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  1.    11 Sep 2015 #1
    Join Date : Jun 2015
    Posts : 299
    Windows 7 (SP1)

    Activating two copies of windows 10 on the same puter


    Hi there

    This has me puzzled

    I have upgraded to windows 10 from my OEM windows 7, now that went okay, and I understand that I now have Windows10 activated on this machine with a continuation of the OEM licence.

    I have a Windows7 retail disk, what will happen if I install that on the same machine, and then upgrade that to Windows10, will that in effect give me a retail version of Windows10 ?

    Just curious
    Zoo
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  2.    11 Sep 2015 #2
    Join Date : Jul 2015
    Posts : 9,552
    Windows 10 Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by zooburner View Post
    I have a Windows7 retail disk, what will happen if I install that on the same machine, and then upgrade that to Windows10, will that in effect give me a retail version of Windows10 ?

    Just curious
    Zoo
    It will give you a second installation of Windows 10 exactly like your first one, including the same generic Windows 10 Product Key (assuming your retail Windows 7 is the same version - Pro or Home - as the OEM Windows 7 was).
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  3.    11 Sep 2015 #3
    Join Date : Jun 2015
    Posts : 299
    Windows 7 (SP1)
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    It will give you a second installation of Windows 10 exactly like your first one, including the same generic Windows 10 Product Key (assuming your retail Windows 7 is the same version - Pro or Home - as the OEM Windows 7 was).
    I understand that, but will my Windows10 rights be OEM or Full retail ?
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  4.    11 Sep 2015 #4
    Join Date : Jul 2015
    Posts : 9,552
    Windows 10 Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by zooburner View Post
    I understand that, but will my Windows10 rights be OEM or Full retail ?
    It will be a free promotional copy of Windows 10 for that computer only not transferable to other computers. It will have the exact same generic Product Key that everyone else has. In order for it to be transferable to other computers, you would have to have a unique product key.
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  5.    11 Sep 2015 #5
    Join Date : Jun 2015
    Posts : 299
    Windows 7 (SP1)
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    It will be a free promotional copy of Windows 10 for that computer only not transferable to other computers. It will have the exact same generic Product Key that everyone else has. In order for it to be transferable to other computers, you would have to have a unique product key.
    So..
    If you upgrade a full retail copy then those rights don't carry, a full retail becomes effectively an OEM ?
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  6.    12 Sep 2015 #6
    Join Date : Jul 2015
    Posts : 3,835
    10 Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by zooburner View Post
    So..
    If you upgrade a full retail copy then those rights don't carry, a full retail becomes effectively an OEM ?
    The EULA says you keep your right to transfer - it seems you just have to phone them as the generic key you get via upgrading doesn't allow this. I phoned them and was given a unique Windows 10 Pro key which then activated automatically though phone activation on a new computer.

    I needed a retail Windows 10 key so I could native boot and run through VM which are seen as 2 different computers. I tried upgrading the host and guest separately (so both hardware hashes would be stored) but that didn't work. I needed a retail Windows 10 key which I was given with no argument once I got through to a MS tech who understood what I meant.
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  7.    12 Sep 2015 #7
    Join Date : Jul 2015
    Posts : 9,552
    Windows 10 Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by zooburner View Post
    So..
    If you upgrade a full retail copy then those rights don't carry, a full retail becomes effectively an OEM ?
    Microsoft GIVES you FOR FREE a copy of Windows 10 for that computer as a promotional offer. Now, as halasz points out, in the EULA it says that retail licenses upgrade to retail Windows 10. That was Microsoft's mistake. They should have done a separate EULA for the promotional giveaway because they never intended to give away full retail transfer rights, they only intended to give away free upgrades on individual computers. However, if called on it, it is cheaper for Microsoft just to give you a unique key than it is to fight it arbitration or a lawsuit.

    If they did go to court, I am pretty sure Microsoft would win for one simple fact - the customer did not pay for Windows 10 therefore the customer could not suffer any losses due to false advertising on Microsoft's part - even if the judge ruled the promotional offer, in combination with the Eula, to be false advertising. But it's just cheaper for Microsoft to give away a couple hundred unique, retail Windows 10 product keys than to pay a lawyer for even 1 hour of time.

    If Microsoft was cancelling the transfer rights of the retail Windows 7/8/8.1 that was being upgraded from - then that would be a different situation - but they aren't. You can still transfer the Windows 7/8/8.1 to a different computer as you always were allowed to - to just have to uninstall it or any resulting upgrade on the old computer first.
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  8.    12 Sep 2015 #8
    Join Date : Aug 2015
    Posts : 610
    W10

    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    Microsoft GIVES you FOR FREE a copy of Windows 10 for that computer as a promotional offer. Now, as halasz points out, in the EULA it says that retail licenses upgrade to retail Windows 10. That was Microsoft's mistake. They should have done a separate EULA for the promotional giveaway because they never intended to give away full retail transfer rights, they only intended to give away free upgrades on individual computers. However, if called on it, it is cheaper for Microsoft just to give you a unique key than it is to fight it arbitration or a lawsuit.
    Note that I have not checked, if what you write is correct. However, if it is, then all Microsoft does is to stick with the license terms, which they offered the end user and which he agreed to. They just stick to a legally binding contract as it is their duty.
    It is not the end user's duty to start thinking about whether Microsoft - should that be - has been too stupid to use the right license. If the end user, through the license, is given a certain right, then it also is his right to make use of this right.
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  9.    12 Sep 2015 #9
    Join Date : Jul 2015
    Posts : 9,552
    Windows 10 Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by Joergi View Post
    Note that I have not checked, if what you write is correct. However, if it is, then all Microsoft does is to stick with the license terms, which they offered the end user and which he agreed to. They just stick to a legally binding contract as it is their duty.
    It is not the end user's duty to start thinking about whether Microsoft - should that be - has been too stupid to use the right license. If the end user, through the license, is given a certain right, then it also is his right to make use of this right.
    Not really. Microsoft never offered to give away free retail copies of Windows 10. All Microsoft offered to do was upgrade computers already running Windows 7/8/8.1 for free to Windows 10 for the life of that computer. Then when someone digs into the EULA of the free upgrade they see the language that would come with a normal purchased upgrade - retail license upgrades to retail license. Which is a legal technicality - not intention. And, so far, when pushed to honor the technicality, Microsoft appears to be cooperative. But when the user first clicks on Upgrade this PC now from Windows 7/8/8.1 - at that point all Microsoft has promised them is to upgrade that one computer for free and the user clicking on Upgrade this PC now should never have been expecting anything more at that point in time.
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  10.    12 Sep 2015 #10
    Join Date : Jul 2015
    Posts : 3,835
    10 Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by NavyLCDR View Post
    Then when someone digs into the EULA of the free upgrade they see the language that would come with a normal purchased upgrade - retail license upgrades to retail license. Which is a legal technicality - not intention. And, so far, when pushed to honor the technicality, Microsoft appears to be cooperative.
    Oh come on. How is this a legal technicality not an intention? It hardly involves digging and it is what you agreed to when you upgraded (even if you didn't read it).

    b. Stand-alone software. If you acquired the software as stand-alone software (and also if you upgraded from software you acquired as stand-alone software), you may transfer the software to another device that belongs to you.
    The EULA isn't either long or complicated and it is surely improbable MS published it without being sure what they meant or asking some of their lawyers to check it.

    Thing is most people do not have retail license and while the upgrade key doesn't cover transfers, neither did their original license. The EULA clearly states what you can do if you have a retail license and this is honored if you activate by phone - they just swap your generic key for a normal one. All they are doing is what they always said they would do.

    Really there is nothing to worry about...
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