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  1.    14 Oct 2015 #41
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,187
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
    Thread Starter

    I got this message from a member of a private forum I belong to:

    MSC devices formatted with a journaling filesystem such as NTFS are safe to hot-unplug without using this option since Vista times , when content is not used, Defender scan only reads data, not writes to. This very ancient safe removal option is written in Windows 2000 times when devices mostly didn't like hot unplugging (that USB implements by design, but manufacturers of devices didn't follow the specifications) and were often supplied by third-party custom non-class drivers. Microsoft still keeps that code for compatibility with these. Standard audio (01h), comms (02h), HID (03h), image (06h), printer (07h), storage (08h), hub (09h), smartcards (0Bh), video (10h), and wireless controllers (E0h) class devices are safe to be hot-unplugged without using the safe remove option. Others (miscellaneous (EFh), WinUSB and MSC with filesystems such as FAT) are better to be removed with the option being used.
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  2.    15 Oct 2015 #42
    Join Date : Apr 2015
    Posts : 12,600
    W10Prox64

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    I got this message from a member of a private forum I belong to:

    MSC devices formatted with a journaling filesystem such as NTFS are safe to hot-unplug without using this option since Vista times , when content is not used, Defender scan only reads data, not writes to. This very ancient safe removal option is written in Windows 2000 times when devices mostly didn't like hot unplugging (that USB implements by design, but manufacturers of devices didn't follow the specifications) and were often supplied by third-party custom non-class drivers. Microsoft still keeps that code for compatibility with these. Standard audio (01h), comms (02h), HID (03h), image (06h), printer (07h), storage (08h), hub (09h), smartcards (0Bh), video (10h), and wireless controllers (E0h) class devices are safe to be hot-unplugged without using the safe remove option. Others (miscellaneous (EFh), WinUSB and MSC with filesystems such as FAT) are better to be removed with the option being used.
    Interesting....hmmmm.....
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  3.    15 Oct 2015 #43
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,187
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by simrick View Post
    Interesting....hmmmm.....
    Yes, because I've always unplugged my external drives without ever thinking of the "Safely Remove" part. Occasionally, I've even yanked out a Flash Drive (without thinking) and never had any ill effects. So, I think he is probably right. Of course, the key would be to be sure whatever's added has had time to complete itself.
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  4.    15 Oct 2015 #44
    Join Date : Jul 2015
    The Woodlands, Texas
    Posts : 141
    Win7 SP1 Ultimate and Win10 16299.15 64bit Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    Yes, because I've always unplugged my external drives without ever thinking of the "Safely Remove" part. Occasionally, I've even yanked out a Flash Drive (without thinking) and never had any ill effects. So, I think he is probably right. Of course, the key would be to be sure whatever's added has had time to complete itself.
    Thanks Wynona. I thought that that had been the case since Vista/Win7 but getting this information is very useful.
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  5.    15 Oct 2015 #45
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,187
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by WEKJR View Post
    Thanks Wynona. I thought that that had been the case since Vista/Win7 but getting this information is very useful.
    Thinking further outside the box, I wonder how many people even know about the "Safely Remove" icon in the System Tray?
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  6.    15 Oct 2015 #46
    Join Date : Nov 2013
    Chicagoland
    Posts : 32,638
    Dual boot Windows 10 Pro x 64 CU build 15063 & Insider Build 16273

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    I got this message from a member of a private forum I belong to:

    MSC devices formatted with a journaling filesystem such as NTFS are safe to hot-unplug without using this option since Vista times , when content is not used, Defender scan only reads data, not writes to. This very ancient safe removal option is written in Windows 2000 times when devices mostly didn't like hot unplugging (that USB implements by design, but manufacturers of devices didn't follow the specifications) and were often supplied by third-party custom non-class drivers. Microsoft still keeps that code for compatibility with these. Standard audio (01h), comms (02h), HID (03h), image (06h), printer (07h), storage (08h), hub (09h), smartcards (0Bh), video (10h), and wireless controllers (E0h) class devices are safe to be hot-unplugged without using the safe remove option. Others (miscellaneous (EFh), WinUSB and MSC with filesystems such as FAT) are better to be removed with the option being used.
    Thanks for passing this along, Wyn.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    Thinking further outside the box, I wonder how many people even know about the "Safely Remove" icon in the System Tray?
    If it be FAT32 or other file systems except NTFS file system they better know where the icon is and using its ejection, as your friend stated. Learned a lesson once. I always knew about "Safely Remove" or right click on the device within the FE to eject via the context menu. One time I forgot and unplugged my very first thumb (Lexar) drive back in Vista and trashed it by doing so. Plug it in and nothing. No Plug n Play sound. Not shown in File Explorer nor Device Manager. Nothing. Nada. Dead!

    Some variables here with odd behaviors. I have 4 thumbs of various brands and sizes. All FAT32. It's touch and go with ejection in 10, although I developed a problem in 8.1 that was solved by fresh install, although that’s not the biggest reason why I fresh installed. Don't remember ever having problems in 7.

    First off, I have AutoPlay set to “Open folder to view files (File Explorer)” when portable drives are plugged in. This does not work, except for one drive, unless I open FE manually, then FE opens if drives are plugged in thereafter until reboot. Very weird behavior. Does anyone have this issue with AutoPlay not initially opening?

    With one of them, a Targus, I can't eject via the tray icon for I get the "In use" warning, but can eject via the FE context menu. However, I can perform either way if I don’t open any files on the drive, so therefore a process stops ejection with the warning even though FE and other programs are all closed. Go figure!

    Another is a SanDisk (Cruzer Glide model) that doesn’t have the eject option on the FE context menu (due to driver?) and can’t eject via the icon for getting the warning, however if I reboot it does. This is the only drive that opens FE initially complying with AutoPlay settings. The other 3 don’t.

    The other two are PNY brand, I have no problems with except for not opening FE initially as I explained.

    All the drives have a generic MS driver. 3 of the drives show up the same in “Portable drives” category in Device Manager as drive J. The SanDisk shows up different and does not have eject on its context menu in FE. Properties view in FE is different also. I’m assuming it must have a more sophisticated driver even though it’s an MS driver.?

    The Targus

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Portable Devices Targus.PNG 
Views:	1 
Size:	45.7 KB 
ID:	42937

    Both the PNYs are the same. Only one shown.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Portable Devices PNYs.PNG 
Views:	1 
Size:	45.1 KB 
ID:	42938

    The SanDisk which shows up with its name I gave it, whereas the others don't. The FE properties and context menu is different and more sophisticated than the others also as I mentioned. That's what leads me to believe that the driver is more sophisticated.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Portable Devices SanDisk.PNG 
Views:	1 
Size:	48.6 KB 
ID:	42939
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  7.    15 Oct 2015 #47
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 1,424
    win 10 Insider

    I don't bother with safely remove!
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  8.    17 Oct 2015 #48
    Join Date : Sep 2015
    Posts : 13
    Windows 10 x64

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    I had already closed everything, but I just went back and closed everything again . . . I still get the same message. BTW, this was also happening in Build 10547 until an update a couple of days ago straightened things out.
    From my experience, this has been happening in all builds, before and since RTM, but NOT in RTM itself!
    What's that about?
    Plug in USB stick and immediately EJECT it and...... it won't let you!
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  9.    17 Oct 2015 #49
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,187
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by mlhifi View Post
    From my experience, this has been happening in all builds, before and since RTM, but NOT in RTM itself!
    What's that about?
    Plug in USB stick and immediately EJECT it and...... it won't let you!
    And contrary to your experience, I've never had it happen consistently in anything but Build 10547 and 10565.

    Hmmm, which leads me to believe that Build 10565 picked up Build 10547's bad habit. Guess a clean install is in order, but not right now. I already have my ISO on my Flash Drive.
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  10.    17 Oct 2015 #50
    Join Date : Sep 2015
    Posts : 13
    Windows 10 x64

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    And contrary to your experience, I've never had it happen consistently in anything but Build 10547 and 10565.

    Hmmm, which leads me to believe that Build 10565 picked up Build 10547's bad habit. Guess a clean install is in order, but not right now. I already have my ISO on my Flash Drive.
    Yes, for me it has been consistant in every build except 10240! Bizarre I know.
    I guess this is why Windows 10 was "opened up" to the world... there are a million different combinations of components out there, making up our individual PC's so there's bound to be a few combinations that behave differently.
    I am, by the way, only talking about ejecting from the USB icon in the Notification area... and it's good to note that, when it does work from there, the LED on the USB device goes OFF, giving you that extra confidence to remove it... that does NOT happen if you eject by right-clicking in "This PC"! Unless someone tells me differently?
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