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  1.    07 Apr 2015 #21
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,895
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281

    Quote Originally Posted by f14tomcat View Post
    It's manual. I didn't go downstairs to look at it, but it's very similar. It was my Mom's from back in the 20's. Must weigh 50#!
    Roger was pulling your leg, Tomcat. Those things lasted forever . . . I finally threw my old one out; it had been in the attic so long that the dirt dobbers got to it and tied all the keys together.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  2.    07 Apr 2015 #22
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Arnold, MD
    Posts : 29,693
    Triple boot - Win 10 Pro, Win 10 Pro Insider (2) - (and a sprinkling of VMs)

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    OK, I can't resist putting in my 2 cents worth . . . when could I ever!? The following is all hypothetical, but maybe it could work?

    So, I have an HP Pavilion 500-056 with Windows 8.1 (or 7) on it. When Windows 10 goes RTM, I choose to upgrade Windows 8.1 to Windows 10. OK, that's a given . . . If I don't like Windows 10, I am given the chance to "downgrade" back to Windows 8.1 one time only.

    Or

    I have a self-built machine with Windows 8.1 (or 7) on it. When Windows 10 goes RTM, I choose to upgrade Windows 8.1 to Windows 10. OK, that's a given . . . If I don't like Windows 10, I am given the chance to "downgrade" back to Windows 8.1 one time only.

    If I go either of these routes, I am no longer qualified for a Windows 10 upgrade from Windows 8.1 (or 7) on that system. After all, Microsoft doesn't need the headache of keeping track of systems that jump back and forth between Windows 10 and 8.1 (or 7) half a dozen times.

    At some point, Microsoft and I must agree that the switch from Windows 8.1 (or 7) to Windows 10 is permanent. At that point, whether I have an actual OEM or Self-Built machine, it will immediately be labeled (for all intents and purposes) an OEM machine. For the life of that (OEM) machine, Windows 10 gets updates and everything else that comes with the OS.

    Once my OEM (or re-certified to OEM) machine dies, Windows also dies. As we all know, if an OEM system cannot be repaired, the OS cannot be transferred to another system.

    I am unsure, though, if the OEM Windows is tied to the motherboard, but I think it is.

    Sooooooo, I would think that with my HP Pavilion 500-056 system already being OEM, that the life of the machine has already been decided?
    That's pretty much what I think, also. MS will be flexible up front but not forever. There will be some kind of agreement between the "upgrader" and "MS" to get as many of the boxes in this world onto 10 as possible. They are not going to tell people who have put $$$ and sweat into home brew machines to go stick it where the sun don't shine!

    I'm still sticking to my Motherboard theory..... when the heart is ripped out or otherwise stops ticking, end of license.
      My ComputersSystem Spec
  3.    07 Apr 2015 #23
    Join Date : Mar 2014
    South Carolina, USA
    Posts : 17,196
    Windows 10 Pro 64-bit

    Quote Originally Posted by f14tomcat View Post
    Chuck, that's the issue. If you buy a new car, the warranty is non-transferable to the new car from the old. There has to be something that identifies the "box" Win 10 is licensed to. Otherwise, every piece, every component could be replaced and you could still claim it as the original device. I doubt MS or anybody would agree to that. IMO, if you replace the motherboard, and by default the MAC, you're starting over. I know, there are ways to change the MAC address, but I doubt that would fly. I'd love to hear others opinions on this.
    Actually no. There is no way to change your MAC, however you can spoof it.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  4.    07 Apr 2015 #24
    Join Date : Jan 2015
    Posts : 194
    Win10

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    OK, I can't resist putting in my 2 cents worth . . . when could I ever!? The following is all hypothetical, but maybe it could work?

    So, I have an HP Pavilion 500-056 with Windows 8.1 (or 7) on it. When Windows 10 goes RTM, I choose to upgrade Windows 8.1 to Windows 10. OK, that's a given . . . If I don't like Windows 10, I am given the chance to "downgrade" back to Windows 8.1 one time only.

    Or

    I have a self-built machine with Windows 8.1 (or 7) on it. When Windows 10 goes RTM, I choose to upgrade Windows 8.1 to Windows 10. OK, that's a given . . . If I don't like Windows 10, I am given the chance to "downgrade" back to Windows 8.1 one time only.

    If I go either of these routes, I am no longer qualified for a Windows 10 upgrade from Windows 8.1 (or 7) on that system. After all, Microsoft doesn't need the headache of keeping track of systems that jump back and forth between Windows 10 and 8.1 (or 7) half a dozen times.

    At some point, Microsoft and I must agree that the switch from Windows 8.1 (or 7) to Windows 10 is permanent. At that point, whether I have an actual OEM or Self-Built machine, it will immediately be labeled (for all intents and purposes) an OEM machine. For the life of that (OEM) machine, Windows 10 gets updates and everything else that comes with the OS.

    Once my OEM (or re-certified to OEM) machine dies, Windows also dies. As we all know, if an OEM system cannot be repaired, the OS cannot be transferred to another system.

    I am unsure, though, if the OEM Windows is tied to the motherboard, but I think it is.

    Sooooooo, I would think that with my HP Pavilion 500-056 system already being OEM, that the life of the machine has already been decided?
    OEM or Homebuilt is really not the issue. All the machines I have running here with the exception of an old IBM Workstation with XP on it, used as a test machine, are home built. I buy the parts, including a motherboard, which has a MAC number on it (in it), and then buy an O/S, Win 8.1 Pro which is tied to the MAC number. Change the mobo and that MAC stays with the old board.
    An Oem license is tied to that old MAC number. The number is supposed to be unique?
    You put a new Mobo, with a new MAC, into your machine, try to activate, and MS says sorry cowboy, that number has been used.
    With a retail license the new board will be activated even with the new MAC number.
    Your HP machine has a MAC number (like a VIN number) so when you accept the upgrade to Win10 the number becomes attached to Win10. ......for life of the device. If it dies tomorrow... life over! You can get another machine (or a new mobo, we don't know yet) and still get a free upgrade to Win10 if you hurry and get it done with the one year period beginning with the release date of Win10. After the year period expires you will have to buy a copy of Win10 in addition to fixing/replacing your machine.
    pheww...... I THINK!
    Does that make any sense?
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  5.    07 Apr 2015 #25
    Join Date : Jan 2015
    Posts : 194
    Win10

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck38 View Post
    Actually no. There is no way to change your MAC, however you can spoof it.
    Spoofing a MAC is like filing the serial number off a gun.......... or grinding off a VIN#.
    I don't recommend it.......... they won't let you use a computer in prison!
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  6.    07 Apr 2015 #26
    Join Date : Jan 2015
    Posts : 194
    Win10

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    Roger was pulling your leg, Tomcat. Those things lasted forever . . . I finally threw my old one out; it had been in the attic so long that the dirt dobbers got to it and tied all the keys together.
    Tattle-tale! I've got a Royal, looks like that, but you should see my portable ScriptWriter! (what is script, you ask?)
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  7.    07 Apr 2015 #27
    Join Date : Mar 2014
    South Carolina, USA
    Posts : 17,196
    Windows 10 Pro 64-bit

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    Spoofing a MAC is like filing the serial number off a gun.......... or grinding off a VIN#.
    I don't recommend it.......... they won't let you use a computer in prison!
    It's not illegal. At least it isn't in South Carolina, I wouldn't be suprised if it's illegal in California though.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  8.    07 Apr 2015 #28
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,895
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    OEM or Homebuilt is really not the issue. All the machines I have running here with the exception of an old IBM Workstation with XP on it, used as a test machine, are home built. I buy the parts, including a motherboard, which has a MAC number on it (in it), and then buy an O/S, Win 8.1 Pro which is tied to the MAC number. Change the mobo and that MAC stays with the old board.
    OK, as I said, I didn't know how the license is tied to the motherboard; I just figured it was, and you've confirmed what I thought. I just didn't understand the mobo has the Mac number. Apples are still apples in this case.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    An Oem license is tied to that old MAC number. The number is supposed to be unique?
    You put a new Mobo, with a new MAC, into your machine, try to activate, and MS says sorry cowboy, that number has been used.
    With a retail license the new board will be activated even with the new MAC number.
    Yes, that's exactly my understanding. Change OEM to Mac number and you still get apples.

    At that point, whether I have an actual OEM or Self-Built machine, it will immediately be labeled (for all intents and purposes) an OEM machine. For the life of that (OEM) machine with its Mac number, Windows 10 gets updates and everything else that comes with the OS.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    Your HP machine has a MAC number (like a VIN number) so when you accept the upgrade to Win10 the number becomes attached to Win10. ......for life of the device. If it dies tomorrow... life over! You can get another machine (or a new mobo, we don't know yet) and still get a free upgrade to Win10 if you hurry and get it done with the one year period beginning with the release date of Win10. After the year period expires you will have to buy a copy of Win10 in addition to fixing/replacing your machine.
    pheww...... I THINK!

    Does that make any sense?
    For the most part, yes. However, if my HP dies with Windows 10 on it, Windows 10 dies. So does Windows 8.1, which is an OEM license. If you replace the mobo, you get a new Mac number; thus, the Windows 8.1 OEM license is no longer valid; you'd have to get another copy.

    If I got another machine, I'd be sure to get one with Windows 10 on it. I'm pretty sure the market will be full of Windows 10 computers as soon as Win 10 goes RTM. Although there may be Windows 8.1 machines out there, I don't really see a reason to get one of those because they probably won't be priced lower than a Win 10 machine because there would be a free upgrade to Windows 10 available.

    You and I may be able to build our own machines, but not everyone can. I got lucky some years back with a "Build or Buy" SIG in our Computer group. I learned . . .

    You've said what I said, although in a different way. We're still on the same page.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  9.    08 Apr 2015 #29
    Join Date : Jan 2015
    Posts : 194
    Win10

    Bargain updates


    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    OK, as I said, I didn't know how the license is tied to the motherboard; I just figured it was, and you've confirmed what I thought. I just didn't understand the mobo has the Mac number. Apples are still apples in this case.



    Yes, that's exactly my understanding. Change OEM to Mac number and you still get apples.

    At that point, whether I have an actual OEM or Self-Built machine, it will immediately be labeled (for all intents and purposes) an OEM machine. For the life of that (OEM) machine with its Mac number, Windows 10 gets updates and everything else that comes with the OS.



    For the most part, yes. However, if my HP dies with Windows 10 on it, Windows 10 dies. So does Windows 8.1, which is an OEM license. If you replace the mobo, you get a new Mac number; thus, the Windows 8.1 OEM license is no longer valid; you'd have to get another copy.

    If I got another machine, I'd be sure to get one with Windows 10 on it. I'm pretty sure the market will be full of Windows 10 computers as soon as Win 10 goes RTM. Although there may be Windows 8.1 machines out there, I don't really see a reason to get one of those because they probably won't be priced lower than a Win 10 machine because there would be a free upgrade to Windows 10 available.

    You and I may be able to build our own machines, but not everyone can. I got lucky some years back with a "Build or Buy" SIG in our Computer group. I learned . . .

    You've said what I said, although in a different way. We're still on the same page.
    It's going to be interesting with downloadable O/Ss. If you find a legal copy of Win7 for $50 or so it may be possible to save a few bucks by installing Win7 and upgrading. Depends on the price that Win10 is issued at???
    Me thinks a lot of online sellers/stores will have an inventory of Win7 and Win8 on hand when Win10 hits. MS won't want them back (WAG) so we may be knee deep in D/L type with a valid key @ 2 for a quarter???
    Time will tell............. I'm gonna round up a quarter just in case!
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  10.    08 Apr 2015 #30
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,895
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    It's going to be interesting with downloadable O/Ss. If you find a legal copy of Win7 for $50 or so it may be possible to save a few bucks by installing Win7 and upgrading. Depends on the price that Win10 is issued at???
    Oh, absolutely! I'm hoping that Windows 10 will be available to me for a few bucks so I don't have to do away with my Windows 8.1 licenses. I'm not sure I have enough Windows 7 licenses to cover all my machines.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roger View Post
    Me thinks a lot of online sellers/stores will have an inventory of Win7 and Win8 on hand when Win10 hits. MS won't want them back (WAG) so we may be knee deep in D/L type with a valid key @ 2 for a quarter???
    Time will tell............. I'm gonna round up a quarter just in case!
    That would be nice.
      My ComputerSystem Spec

 
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