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  1.    16 Mar 2016 #21
    Join Date : May 2015
    Posts : 112

    Quote Originally Posted by Mystere View Post
    More than likely because they don't want to keep maintaining older versions of Windows. Windows 10 may not be costing them money, but older versions of Windows do.
    Not so much actually. I base this on Microsoft's own model from my days at the company.(not to mention it is a standard model for all software releases.) The support curve spikes on release and then gradually reduces. Because Microsoft charges for support after a warranty period their model comes closer to breaking even on something like Windows 7.(Actually they make money, lots of money. That's what service contracts are for, among other things.) Also, their own support model runs until 2020, so it isn't like the costing model for Windows 7 is somehow out of whack.

    Windows 10 on the other hand will have a higher support cost. Mostly because it is shipping free, support is free initially, and they are buried in support issues. Every new patch release brings on even newer bugs. With the more frequent releases that support curve maintains its higher levels for extended periods of time. This means they are likely trying to kill off Windows 7 early not because of direct cost, but because they need to free up people to work on Windows 10 or higher more developers/support folks. Unfortunately for Microsoft, the bulk of their users are business customers. Large corporations and business just moved to Windows 7, so for all their kicking and screaming they won't move that elephant until it is ready to move on its own. For the consumer they may find their market share begin to shrink. As everything goes multi-platform people are going with what works. No, this isn't an Apple endorsement, merely stating that whatever it is, consumers will migrate to it if that stable and consistent platform runs the programs they need.
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  2.    16 Mar 2016 #22

    Quote Originally Posted by Trust_No1 View Post
    Starting from Microsoft's inception Windows revenues from all those computer sales, was indeed it's cash cow. That no longer is the case, I don't see their app business being a large generator either. I also believe Windows 10 (IMO) will remain free, so that they can turn the Windows OS into a marketing software, wherein they collect data on users to sell. I just don't believe people will run out and spend $110-$150 for the new OS. I also believe, MS can no longer charge a premium for their OS to OEM's. Those days are over.
    I agree that Windows will likely become a service or conduit, by which other products are distributed. If they do want to wind down the "Explorer" portion of Windows (the conventional part), they'll need to wait until business has fully shifted away from conventional productivity applications (such as office suites) and on to specialized apps that can be used with the modern/metro interface. I think that's coming. A lot of companies have distributed tablets to field techs, sales people, and many office people. And many of them are adapting to a non-windowing environment for day to day work.

    Quote Originally Posted by Trust_No1 View Post
    I believe these reasons are why MS is pushing the new Windows 10 so hard. They can see the hand writing on the wall, it is also why, I believe, Microsoft should keep supporting their Windows 8 software and separate Windows 10 as it's own platform, just as Apple has done with OSX and iOS.
    But wasn't Windows RT more like what iOS is? Or Windows Phone OS for that matter? Aren't they biting the dust now?

    I think that Microsoft believes a gradual transition from a windowing system to mobile apps will be better acommodated using a unified product, rather than two products. That way the OS retains a familirity throught the pace of change, allowing users to beome better acustomed to the new product. I'm not saying that 's the correct way, just Microsoft's way.
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  3.    16 Mar 2016 #23
    Join Date : Aug 2014
    Australia, Adelaide
    Posts : 1,569
    W7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), LM 18.2 MATE (64 bit), W10 Home (64 bit)

    Quote Originally Posted by MrBill View Post
    BunnyJ is right. Big iron still exists, and in fact runs Linux now. The PC is going nowhere. Although they "declined", 71.9 million were sold last year. Also, today's PC's remain viable far longer than they did even 5 years ago. There is always a place for the PC. The cloud is a great concept for the masses. However, the super users, and technologist that understand how the internet works knows it's better to be in control of your own data, and where possible applications.
    What I mean is that the current style of desktops/laptops will probably be replaced by OEM terminal-style machines (like Chromebooks).

    "Real" desktops/laptops will still be sold, but the prices will increase markedly (i.e. back to the early '80s PC levels).
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  4.    16 Mar 2016 #24
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 1,555
    W7 32 bit, Linux Mint Xfce 18 64 bit

    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    What I mean is that the current style of desktops/laptops will probably be replaced by OEM terminal-style machines (like Chromebooks).

    "Real" desktops/laptops will still be sold, but the prices will increase markedly (i.e. back to the early '80s PC levels).
    I hope you are wrong. I like to play a few small games offline that my eyes can handle.
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  5.    16 Mar 2016 #25
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Oak Ridge TN, USA
    Posts : 24,523
    Windows 10 Pro x64

    Quote Originally Posted by lehnerus2000 View Post
    What I mean is that the current style of desktops/laptops will probably be replaced by OEM terminal-style machines (like Chromebooks).

    "Real" desktops/laptops will still be sold, but the prices will increase markedly (i.e. back to the early '80s PC levels).
    I really doubt it.... PC hobbyist will still exist for some time to come.
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  6.    16 Mar 2016 #26
    Join Date : Nov 2013
    Idaho USA
    Posts : 4,826
    OS X, Win 10

    I guess it is time to go back to uni to get a MBA. . .I mean with all the folks here on the tens who seem to know what Microsoft is doing wrong, and what they should do to make the company run right I need to update my education so I can understand better what it is they are saying, so that I to can help Microsoft do thinks right. . .
    Last edited by Lee; 17 Mar 2016 at 02:02.
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  7.    17 Mar 2016 #27

    Quote Originally Posted by Jody Thornton View Post
    I agree that Windows will likely become a service or conduit, by which other products are distributed. If they do want to wind down the "Explorer" portion of Windows (the conventional part), they'll need to wait until business has fully shifted away from conventional productivity applications (such as office suites) and on to specialized apps that can be used with the modern/metro interface. I think that's coming. A lot of companies have distributed tablets to field techs, sales people, and many office people. And many of them are adapting to a non-windowing environment for day to day work.



    But wasn't Windows RT more like what iOS is? Or Windows Phone OS for that matter? Aren't they biting the dust now?

    I think that Microsoft believes a gradual transition from a windowing system to mobile apps will be better acommodated using a unified product, rather than two products. That way the OS retains a familirity throught the pace of change, allowing users to beome better acustomed to the new product. I'm not saying that 's the correct way, just Microsoft's way.
    The problem is that with Windows 10 they are trying to remove all parts of Legacy applications, so other than CPU instructions, it will eventually become not much more than an RT unit. Therein, why I think they should split off 10. Perhaps they will call it the Windows 10 Chromebook. MS wants all apps supplied through their store (how iOS is setup). They really don't want to have developers create Legacy type software (they can't cash in, on it). That is what I believe their ultimate goal is, they are looking at it 10-20 years from now. Sad really. Perhaps by then Linux will become more user friendly by then.
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  8.    17 Mar 2016 #28
    Join Date : May 2015
    Posts : 112

    Quote Originally Posted by Lee View Post
    I guess it is time to go back to uni to get a MBA. . .I mean with all the folks here on the tens who seem to know what Microsoft is doing wrong, and what they should do to make the company run right I need to update my education so I can understand better what it is they are saying, so that I to can help Microsoft do thinks right. . .
    I still know some folks in the company. Believe me, it is far from the same corporation of the 90's. I think the new CEO is doing some good things to get the company moving in the right direction. Back when I was there if you had shipped your code incomplete or returned a legacy bug into new code you likely would have been fired. Windows did not normally ship with Windows 3.1 interfaces in Windows 95. They completed the work. Microsoft has shipped code recently that would fix one bug only to return a legacy bug in the process. This is a clear indication that their change control process, specifically version control, internally is out of whack. This is hopefully just a blip caused by the massive shakeup in the last couple of years. However, I hope it is not indicative of other companies who have off shored and are getting less experienced developers than they would have hired in the past.
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  9.    17 Mar 2016 #29

    Quote Originally Posted by BunnyJ View Post
    I really doubt it.... PC hobbyist will still exist for some time to come.
    Hi there
    Actually just look at the sales of Microservers -- these are CHEAPER than a typical desktop, quite flexible and since designed as servers from the outset are very robust, reliable and consume little power. The "Little cubes" are selling really well.

    Sales of these to HOME users has actually increased quite a bit -- they make excellent NAS servers too -- I've got TWO of these (HP GEN 8 PROLIANT MICROSERVER. You can run a desktop OS on these too if you need to.

    They have a very small footprint so can easily be hidden away unnoticed into small storage spaces and rarely once set up need to be re-booted.
    OK not for Gamers as there's only limited expansion capability but you can add a decent Graphics / RAID card and with easy accessible HDD Bays why would I even THINK of a desktop any more -- for my needs the microservers are just FINE. !!

    The new generation of ultra thin laptops is great too - finally they've got away from the 1366 X 768 video screens even on smaller models and the Surface Pro / book 4 is absolutely fantastic - these will be around for a long time.

    Classical computing still has its place -- just not so much in future as the smart phone can do a lot of easy stuff that used to require a computer -- but try and prepare a demo / create a complex spreadsheet or design a complex building or engineering tool on a mobile phone --- forget it !!!!

    Cheers
    jimbo
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  10.    17 Mar 2016 #30
    Join Date : Aug 2014
    Australia, Adelaide
    Posts : 1,569
    W7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), LM 18.2 MATE (64 bit), W10 Home (64 bit)

    Quote Originally Posted by jimbo45 View Post
    Classical computing still has its place -- just not so much in future as the smart phone can do a lot of easy stuff that used to require a computer -- but try and prepare a demo / create a complex spreadsheet or design a complex building or engineering tool on a mobile phone --- forget it !!!!
    I've seen people claim that you can do video editing in the Cloud.

    If that is true, then basically you'd only need a terminal-style machine (i.e. a Chromebook-type device).
    If you didn't have enough grunt, you'd just have to pay for a more expensive virtual Cloud server (and maybe more Internet bandwidth).

    Businesses that needed actual PCs would just write off the purchase cost (and there's Depreciation too) so the cost would be basically irrelevant.
    In First World countries, PCs cost much less to buy, than employees cost to hire, train and pay.
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