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  1. Joined : Aug 2014
    Australia, Adelaide
    Posts : 1,394
    W7 Ultimate SP1 (64 bit), LM 18.1 MATE (64 bit), W10IP VM, W10 Home
       03 Mar 2015 #31

    Mark Phelps said: View Post
    What really "makes no sense" in my view is the stubborn position taken by MS. They already have the code for Start Menus because they deployed them in Win7. But instead of offering us a choice of menu styles (which Stardock does with Start8 and Start10), they insist on continuing to force their "Metro" on us all. As long as they continue to deny their customers choices, third-party providers will be more than willing to fill the gaps.
    It was even worse than that.
    The Start Menu code was in W8DP.

    When MS dicovered that people were re-enabling the Start Menu, they removed the code from the subsequent versions.

    I suspect that action was part of the reason that there was so much "push back" against W8.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  2. Joined : Nov 2013
    Idaho USA
    Posts : 4,534
    OS X, Win 10
       03 Mar 2015 #32

    Mark Phelps said: View Post
    I would have agreed if MS had left the Start Menu alone, but when they changed it (not "improved" it) to make it Metro, I didn't like the change and used the hack posted to return to the previous Start Menu style.

    That said, the folks distributing start menu alternatives are basically following up on what they did for Win8.

    What really "makes no sense" in my view is the stubborn position taken by MS. They already have the code for Start Menus because they deployed them in Win7. But instead of offering us a choice of menu styles (which Stardock does with Start8 and Start10), they insist on continuing to force their "Metro" on us all. As long as they continue to deny their customers choices, third-party providers will be more than willing to fill the gaps.
    Oh god their really forcing it on you. . .run for the hills here comes the big bad Microsoft Sea Team to force you to use something you don't want to use. How can they be so mean. . .oh that big Microsoft. . .
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  3. Joined : Sep 2014
    Posts : 84
    Windows
       03 Mar 2015 #33

    Mark Phelps said: View Post
    But instead of offering us a choice of menu styles, they insist on continuing to force their "Metro" on us all.
    I distinctly remember during the Whistler XP beta the decision by Microsoft to give users choice and the outcry about the new start-menu:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    At the time Microsoft was seriously against allowing users to have the option of "Classic Start menu" because the new one was <insert eyecandy here> better than the Classic menu... The case being made at the time for removing the option was something like "users will just disable the new menu and continue hating it forever... BUT if they just used it for awhile, they will really like it once they get used to it" but they were more afraid of the amount of negative feedback to completely remove the choice.

    Some people like eyecandy and others like tried and true functionality, Windows 8 included a start-screen with less functionality just to improve eye-candy and was clearly disliked by the majority during the Windows 8 beta... At least this time there appears to be some built-in support for 3rd party start-menu applications and options to use a start-menu or start-screen
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  4. Joined : Oct 2014
    Posts : 1,542
    W7 32 bit, Linux Mint Xfce 18 64 bit
       03 Mar 2015 #34

    People like the classic desktop. I like windows 98se desktop, I made windows 7 and my other operating system look real close to windows 98se. Not everyone likes change. We are not asking not to change but also keep an option for the windows classic destop. I see nothing wrong with that at all.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  5. Joined : Oct 2013
    Posts : 1,962
    Windows 7
       03 Mar 2015 #35

    I will toggle the 8.1 start page and the full Apps page. I hope they don't take that away.I never liked the old start menu nor do I like the new one - it's a bit better than the Win 7 menu and a lot better than the XP menu (what a disaster), but the start page combined with the Apps page is the ultimate.

    But the one I really like is this one:


    Click image for larger version. 

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      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  6. Joined : Jan 2014
    Washington
    Posts : 302
    Windows 10 10586
       04 Mar 2015 #36

    lehnerus2000 said: View Post
    There were basically no Start Screen improvements in W8 (DP through to RTM)
    Some improvements were made in W8.1 though.
    But this isn't Windows 8.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  7. Joined : Jan 2014
    Washington
    Posts : 302
    Windows 10 10586
       04 Mar 2015 #37

    Mark Phelps said: View Post
    I would have agreed if MS had left the Start Menu alone, but when they changed it (not "improved" it) to make it Metro, I didn't like the change and used the hack posted to return to the previous Start Menu style.

    That said, the folks distributing start menu alternatives are basically following up on what they did for Win8.

    What really "makes no sense" in my view is the stubborn position taken by MS. They already have the code for Start Menus because they deployed them in Win7. But instead of offering us a choice of menu styles (which Stardock does with Start8 and Start10), they insist on continuing to force their "Metro" on us all. As long as they continue to deny their customers choices, third-party providers will be more than willing to fill the gaps.
    You don't like them forcing their design language across Bing, Xbox, Windows Phones and PCs, and Outlook.com services? Because that's metro.

    Start Screen design is something else.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  8. Joined : Jan 2014
    Washington
    Posts : 302
    Windows 10 10586
       04 Mar 2015 #38

    whs said: View Post
    I will toggle the 8.1 start page and the full Apps page. I hope they don't take that away.I never liked the old start menu nor do I like the new one - it's a bit better than the Win 7 menu and a lot better than the XP menu (what a disaster), but the start page combined with the Apps page is the ultimate.

    But the one I really like is this one:


    Click image for larger version. 

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Views:	94 
Size:	180.4 KB 
ID:	13657
    My preference is more for taking the newer bits of Windows 10's Start Screen, put that in Windows 8.1 form. The whole side bar, kind of reminiscent of Windows 7 thing is just nonsense. I'll even take the extreme stance as an insult to my intelligence. /s

    But no seriously, REALLY don't like that side bar that takes up a ton of space for nothing, REALLY despise the All Apps disaster, and REALLY not keen on the up and down scrolling of it now. If dissent thought Microsoft took Windows Phone and blew it up for Windows 8, they're wrong because at least it was made with a different usage scenario in mind. Windows 10 is literally just that, Windows Phone's Start Screen blown up bit for bit. Normally I would be ok with that, but a side to side scroll allowed more content to be easily viewed as it's similar to reading a book left to right. This, whatever this is, just isn't working.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  9. Joined : Nov 2013
    Houston
    Posts : 1,397
    Win-7Prox64 Win-8.1Prox64 Win-10Prox64
       04 Mar 2015 #39

    Mark Phelps said: View Post
    I would have agreed if MS had left the Start Menu alone, but when they changed it (not "improved" it) to make it Metro, I didn't like the change and used the hack posted to return to the previous Start Menu style.

    That said, the folks distributing start menu alternatives are basically following up on what they did for Win8.

    What really "makes no sense" in my view is the stubborn position taken by MS. They already have the code for Start Menus because they deployed them in Win7. But instead of offering us a choice of menu styles (which Stardock does with Start8 and Start10), they insist on continuing to force their "Metro" on us all. As long as they continue to deny their customers choices, third-party providers will be more than willing to fill the gaps.
    Another thought that may repeat is people will not upgrade just like the failing 8-8.1,
    Three in a row subpar releases by Microsoft would be pretty eye opening to most companies
    Possibly by win-12 we will see Microsoft open it's eye's.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  10. Joined : Mar 2015
    California
    Posts : 19
    Windows 7 64-bit
       04 Mar 2015 #40

    You guys are missing the point. Unlike the Windows 8 Era, the point is that there will be a usable start menu and Microsoft is no longer throwing hurdles in the path of third-party vendors who make them. A usable base interface, but which can be customized and jazzed up by third-parties. You know... like Windows USED TO BE.. and heck.. MS-DOS before that and the bloody doskey, Norton Commander, and thousands of other stuff back when Shareware meant something more than we just shared our latest malware with you.

    Put simply, having third-party options for customization and companies that support it is a great thing, having one set way and one mythical start menu that everyone loves, is not.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


 
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