Windows 10: Dual Boot Windows 10 with Windows 7 or Windows 8  

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  1. Posts : 3,358
    W10 Pro x64/W7 Ultimate x64 dual boot main - W10 Pro Insider Preview/W7 Pro x64 - remote pc
       05 May 2017 #280

    Besides the Hyper-V you have the other 3rd party ware as far as VMs go. As for VMWare's Workstation Player that does't work across the cloud but creates an environment on your machine which stores the VM as a file on the local drive. The AV software you have on would still provide protection for the main OS while connecting online by VM at times can prove risky if the connection is made.

    Most of the time a VM is seen for being able to run and try out some other OS if not simply running an older version of Windows so older apps can be used. As for dual booting across two separate drives Kaspersky shouldn't be interfering or you may want to consider going with a different software. First however you may want to spent a little time at Kaspersky's support site looking things up.

    As far as the dual boot set up when you already have the two versions installed each on separate drives editing the intended host OS's BCD store to add in the boot entry for the other which in this case would be 7. To simply that since you already have two working copies of Windows 7 and 10 already in use you can use a gui method to add 7 into the existing 10 install with a little help from a 3rd party app many have been using since the Vista days.

    What does is leave the 7 drive totally unchanged in any way. The two main options are either the manual edit of the BCD store with the command line BCDEditor tool or the EasyBCD app developed about 10yrs. After having dual booted prior to the development of the BCD store even like XP with 98SE the introduction of the BCD store first seen with Vista and the gui app being developed that made dual boots easier to set up when both OSs were already running but on separate drives typically as "Stand Alone" types of install isolated from each other.

    What the guide here does is explain how to proceed before 10 first goes on. But with 10 already on you can simply the process even further by simply editing the BCD store to add in the boot entry for the existing 7 install without fuss. No need to install 10 a second time or split up the 7 just to get on when you already have 10 up and running. This will still have to be your decision there however. All anyone can do here is point out the options.
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  2.    05 May 2017 #281

    In my opinion the best way to install windows 7 on a windows 10 pc as dual boot is to install windows 7 in a virtual hard drive rather than making separate partitions. This is very easy to do.

    1) In windows 10 create a directory (path and names can vary and can be on any drive) e.g. c:\win7

    2) Go to disk management and create a virtual drive (recommend vhdx expandable and set a maxium size) e,g. c:\win7\win7.vhdx

    3) boot from windows 7 installation usb (or dvd) and press shift+f10 to jump to a command prompt.

    4) type following

    c:
    cd\
    diskpart
    select vdisk file=c:\win7\win7.vhdx
    attach vdisk
    exit
    exit (yes twice)

    You can now install windows 7 in the virtual hard drive (will be last in list of drives).

    This method only creates one file (win7.vhdx) and adds a boot entry.

    To later uninstall it, just delete win7.vhdx and remove boot entry using msconfig.

    Only minor hassle is it reverts boot menu to old windows 7 stype but easy enough to change back to 8/10 style.

    This method does not add or modify any partitions (except the efi or system reserved partition) in any way.

    Easy to do and minimal risk. Only minor hassle with a vhd file is you cannot do a build upgrade without going through some hoops and loops. This is not an issue with Windows 7 of course but is an issue for Windows 10.
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  3. Posts : 3,358
    W10 Pro x64/W7 Ultimate x64 dual boot main - W10 Pro Insider Preview/W7 Pro x64 - remote pc
       05 May 2017 #282

    It depends mainly on what you are going to be doing in each version. If you are planning to run numerous apps which many apps that run on 7 have been to run on 10 as well you will need one commodity in particular being "Drive Space" and why the two versions remain running on separate drives here. That also allows for storage of immediate items like small installation files for various apps as well as if you use multiple browsers different versions of each, other personal files, etc. and still leave room to have a good number of programs on each version.

    Now if you already have both versions installed and running well on two separate drives the solution is simply adding the boot entry for generally the older version into the BCD of the newer. In the Boot tab of the msconfig you can always go back in there and change which will be the default OS as well as adjust the boot time. If presently looking to expand storage/backup capacity and not planning to run much on 7 or even on 10 then the idea of splitting up the 7 drive by shrinking the 7 primary down enough to allow a working secondary primary for 10 comes into play. Or as the VM for the older version can work for just the basics with 7 you would create an adequate sized VHD for 7 on the 10 side of the equation and consider nuking the 7 install from the drive you plan to use to convert to storage and backup.

    The thing to remember is that there are a number of options for custom installs to consider depending on what your wants or needs require. It all depends on how you want your system set up.
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  4. Posts : 628
    7 and 10 on various machines
       05 May 2017 #283

    Ok well late last night I finally got things fixed that I shall use for a while before trying the VM stuf.

    I did find out that when talking of two drives in a dual boot it really means one SSD and two partitions each partition then becoming the "two drives" because being a totally logical and even a concrete thinker as I was thinking two SSD's - I know I am ruddy hopeless when it comes to understanding what seems to be common knowledge amongst you experienced fellows and gals. I gleaned this from the third phone all to Microsoft when the techie explained this to me and then the penny dropped - quite long way as it happens
    I must apologise for making things so convoluted to everyone but now it is time for forty (or more) winks but at least forearmed so to speak.

    So what I have finally set up are two SSD's one with the OEM 10 on it only and I shall keep it like that because I have to say I am getting a used to using 10 as I am using 7.
    The other SSD I had setup up with two partitions as per the tutorial and it was the misunderstanding re the'drives" that was throwing me. In any case I dual booted that SSD with 7 on it already using a 10 ISO and it took all night to update and do what it does beginning at version 1511?? and now is on version 1607 and I am guessing it will still keep going with the updates right now as I am also guessing it will have to work through the versions to get to the version that are on the other machines - 1703.

    I have found another spare SSD that I shall install as a backup image disk for one of the installs and I am inclined to do that for the straight 10 install.

    So once again I must thank you all for putting up with me I really do appreciate everything that you all have done and because you have all been so patient too.
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  5.    05 May 2017 #284

    I agree with the others, forget the dual-booting setup entirely. Use a VM for Windows 7 instead.....it is significantly less complex, and less prone to error.

    1, Install Windows 10 and update fully.
    2. Use he native Hyper-V in W10 to run W7 as a VM......Hyper-V virtualization - Setup and Use in Windows 10 - Windows 10 Virtualization Tutorials

    Alternatively, use the free VMWarePlayer or VirtualBox applications to that.

    I really do not think dual-booting is for you.
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  6.    05 May 2017 #285

    At risk of sounding boring, I am always amazed when people push the vm solution over dual booting when as a rule vms give a performance hit. It makes sense to use a vm for Insider versions or alternative OSs.

    For a stable OS like 7, a dual boot solution is a good solution. As I said earlier, a really neat solution with minimal impact on current install is to install Windows 7 in a virtual hard drive. Then you get "best of both worlds".
      My ComputerSystem Spec


  7. Posts : 628
    7 and 10 on various machines
       05 May 2017 #286

    Ok well I am now wondering what to do because I really don't fully understand the VM set ups an my dual boot seems to be going pretty well at he moment - probably am jinxing myself here.

    To be honest I read through Karis tutorial on setting the VM up and I am still coming to the slightest of grips with what the heck it actually is because sorry I am not a techie, no expert as everyone knows and besides my son his wife and the grand kids - electronics and computers are just a couple of my last real pleasures in life.
    So if having a VM means that I can flit from one OS to the next at the touch of a button then I might have a go and I suppose a few videos on what is entailed in setting it up and what it does afterwards would be my best bet.

    Right now the only options I have is to hook the dual drive up to one of the high speed SATA sockets/ports if I want to use it and swap over the lead to use the full blown 10 drive because I am not sure what would happen if I hooked up the dedicated 10 drive/SSD to the other high speed SATA port knowing my luck just lately the machine would disappear in a cloud of smoke.
    There is also the ways things are going at he moment and even though I said before I would always be with 7 I am getting to like 10 more and more.

    Now no reflection on anyone but the Ten Forum does seem to be more useful to the really tech wise members amongst us as I find a lot of the threads / tutorials in here are losing me a bit as I tended to understand more in the Seven Forum threads - again those that know me - not overly good in there either, and I can't put my finger on what it is - although performance seems to be the rule of the day.
    Personally I find that a boot time of 20- 25 seconds quick enough and clicking on a new tab happens before one's finger leaves the key/button/ mouse click is such a difference to the old stuff we used to put up with back before XP for example and I don't know but each new system that is brought out appears to be to be littered with bugs, issues and problems.
    I think folks like Brink for example do a wonderful job with that stuff plus the usual tutorials and posts etc etc and frankly I don't know how he does it.
    But I am getting OT here eh?
      My ComputerSystem Spec

  8.    05 May 2017 #287

    ICIT2LOL said: View Post
    Ok well I am now wondering what to do because I really don't fully understand the VM set ups an my dual boot seems to be going pretty well at he moment - probably am jinxing myself here.

    To be honest I read through Karis tutorial on setting the VM up and I am still coming to the slightest of grips with what the heck it actually is because sorry I am not a techie, no expert as everyone knows and besides my son his wife and the grand kids - electronics and computers are just a couple of my last real pleasures in life.
    So if having a VM means that I can flit from one OS to the next at the touch of a button then I might have a go and I suppose a few videos on what is entailed in setting it up and what it does afterwards would be my best bet.

    Right now the only options I have is to hook the dual drive up to one of the high speed SATA sockets/ports if I want to use it and swap over the lead to use the full blown 10 drive because I am not sure what would happen if I hooked up the dedicated 10 drive/SSD to the other high speed SATA port knowing my luck just lately the machine would disappear in a cloud of smoke.
    There is also the ways things are going at he moment and even though I said before I would always be with 7 I am getting to like 10 more and more.

    Now no reflection on anyone but the Ten Forum does seem to be more useful to the really tech wise members amongst us as I find a lot of the threads / tutorials in here are losing me a bit as I tended to understand more in the Seven Forum threads - again those that know me - not overly good in there either, and I can't put my finger on what it is - although performance seems to be the rule of the day.
    Personally I find that a boot time of 20- 25 seconds quick enough and clicking on a new tab happens before one's finger leaves the key/button/ mouse click is such a difference to the old stuff we used to put up with back before XP for example and I don't know but each new system that is brought out appears to be to be littered with bugs, issues and problems.
    I think folks like Brink for example do a wonderful job with that stuff plus the usual tutorials and posts etc etc and frankly I don't know how he does it.
    But I am getting OT here eh?
    The only reason I would use a vm for W7 is if I wanted to run W7 simultaneously with W10 which is probably rare.
      My ComputerSystem Spec


  9. Posts : 628
    7 and 10 on various machines
       05 May 2017 #288

    Yep cerebus mate I thought that was what it meant though I will have to watch a video on it because I like to see things in my minds eye if you know what I mean. It just seems to be a lot of work to set it up when all I have to do is reboot and pick 7.

    The issue for me is if I am answering something in the 7 forum and am running 10 then it makes t hard to say open Control Panel as in 7 and snip say a pic to send as the CP in here is not quite the same. I do have a library full of snips to attach to posts but they are now getting quit outdated even in 7 fore example the Partition Wizard GUI.
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  10. Posts : 3,358
    W10 Pro x64/W7 Ultimate x64 dual boot main - W10 Pro Insider Preview/W7 Pro x64 - remote pc
       06 May 2017 #289

    The point Is you were able to make a decision as to what you were going to doing in the end run. Now that you have decided to keep 10 intact on the first drive which can actually be set in the bios as the first drive in the order you can also bump or save that "Would Have Been" secondary primary on the other drive by simply removing it to expand the 7 primary back OR utilize that reserved drive space for a storage/backup place. System image backup or manual storage of Personal files can be placed there isolated and safe from any other OS or other changes to come up including any possible malwares.

    As far as grabbing screens for let's say Vista I can't quite at this time go back to VF and start trying to give full descriptions with screens either no longer having Vista running on anything even a VM while I still have the original Retail dvd. And I couldn't do much for 8/8.1 either having bypassed BOTH in favor of keeping 7 and waiting for 10 to come along which of course I already knew would surpass 8 and 8.1 when MS decided to mix Mobile and Desktop platforms together. After coming up from 3.1, 95, 98SE, XP, Vista into 7 I had found then I would invest not in the Enterprise but next highest up on the ladder Ultimate edition and never regretted it to this day! But I also knew that after the second or third next version to come along MS would start getting things right with the dual platform OS seen with 10! So here we are all wanting BOTH!
      My ComputerSystem Spec


 
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