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  1.    30 Apr 2017 #1
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Posts : 1,393
    Windows 10 Pro (32-bit) 16299.15

    Old computers not yet compatible with 1703 (Broadcom 440x driver)


    Edit: See below for info on a fix

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Just a heads up for anyone with an old computer (Vista/XP era, I guess) who wants to upgrade to the Creators' Update (1703).

    Before you try the upgrade, check you don't have a Broadcom 440x ethernet driver. On my computer it's listed in Device Manager as:
    "Broadcom 440x 10/100 Integrated Controller"
    Click image for larger version. 

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    If you *do* have that device, read on before you upgrade.

    Although Anniversary Update (1607) works fine with this driver, currently (30 April 2017), if Windows 10 Creators' Update (1703) is installed, the driver will stop a clean-install from completing (circling dots circle for ever). On an upgrade install, the ethernet driver also takes down the WiFi driver so you can't connect to a network through either route. They look OK in Device Manager but they aren't. Neither can you simply 'Disable' the offending driver in Device Manager - it just seems to hang.

    This thread on Microsoft Answers has a post from a Microsoft person saying they know about the bug in Creators' Update and are trying to fix it:
    https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...3-a64b92445385
    Hello. I am an Engineer in the Windows Networking team. I can confirm that there is a bug in the Creators Update that affects the compatibility with the Broadcom 440x driver. We are working on resolving this until it is resolved. We are looking at putting a upgrade block in place as erpmanila3w suggested.

    Thank you for reporting this! I will keep this thread posted if there are any updates. Meanwhile following the steps mentioned in this thread will work around the issue (if you can call disabling Ethernet a valid workaround) until we have a real fix available.

    If you have any questions please let me know.
    On the thread some people have got 1703 to install by disabling the ethernet hardware in their BIOS, but some computers (like mine) don't have that option.

    But I think the best course is to wait for Microsoft to issue a fix.
    Edit:
    There is now an official fix released, in the latest cumulative update to version 1703.

    https://answers.microsoft.com/messag...3-a64b92445385

    Quote Originally Posted by Travis_MSFT
    I can confirm that the latest cumulative update has the Broadcom 440x fix. It was released 18 hours ago. For those that are curious this is build 15063.502. This has been a long four month drive to getting this fix investigated, fixed, and released. Thank you all for your patience. If you continue to have issues with the Broadcom 440x after applying this update please let us know on this thread.
    The only thing I'm not sure is whether the downloadable ISOs will contain the fix. But I imagine that if you use the latest Media Creation Toolkit for 1703, the cumulative update will be included in any media you create.
    Last edited by DavidY; 02 Aug 2017 at 12:00.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  2.    16 Jun 2017 #2
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Posts : 1,393
    Windows 10 Pro (32-bit) 16299.15
    Thread Starter

    Just to flag up that there was an update on this issue on June 6th from a Microsoft representative (page 10 of this thread)
    I wanted to give you an update on the issue. This is specially regarding the Broadcom 440x and not about any other issues which have been brought up on this thread.

    First, a brief synopsis of the technical details: The Broadcom 440x is a XP/Vista era driver and hasn't been updated in many years. As you know it has worked faithfully all those years. The creators update introduced some new features that take advantage of some Network Card hardware optimizations that are available on newer models. These features have been available on Server versions of windows for some time. But starting with the creators update the optimizations are now available on client versions. Unfortunately the Broadcom 440x has a bug where it returns incorrect responses when Windows asks it about support for the hardware optimizations. This exposes an additional bug in tcpip.sys which causes the symptoms that have been reported.

    Given the nature of support for the old driver we cannot fix the Broadcom 440x. But we can fix the bug tcpip.sys. Doing so should cause the symptoms (hang during update, no network connectivity, 100% CPU usage in kernel) to be fixed.

    Here is how any fix like this will be released. First the fix will be released to Windows Insiders who are signed up to receive prelease builds. Once we have confirmation from the field that we did not regress anything it will be deployed as an update to non insiders running the Creators Update. Also the links to installation media and upgrades will be switched to the new build that has the fix.

    When will all this happen? I cannot give any dates at this time. I will keep this thread updated when I do know. I can say that in general this process (release to insiders, review results, release to non insiders) usually takes about a month if there are no snags.

    As I said, when there is more I can comment on, or when something is released I will update this thread.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  3.    17 Jun 2017 #3
    Join Date : Jun 2015
    UK
    Posts : 2,099
    Windows 10 Home x64 (Laptop), Windows 10 Pro x64 (Desktop)

    I guess you won't be offered an automatic update to the CU until MS consider the upgrade is suitable for your PC. I haven't been offered the CU yet for my 3 year old Dell Inspiron laptop.
      My ComputersSystem Spec
  4.    17 Jun 2017 #4
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Posts : 1,393
    Windows 10 Pro (32-bit) 16299.15
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve C View Post
    I guess you won't be offered an automatic update to the CU until MS consider the upgrade is suitable for your PC. I haven't been offered the CU yet for my 3 year old Dell Inspiron laptop.
    Yeah - as far as I can tell from comments earlier in that thread, once they found out about the issue, they blocked it so that the CU won't be offered automatically for devices with that Broadcom network adaptor, until they fix it.

    Your 3 year old Dell is unlikely to have this particular Broadcom device though. More likely it's just that they roll out CU gradually, starting with newest devices first as the most likely to be compatible, and haven't got to yours yet. Plus there's probably a link in the Windows Update page in settings which I think allows you to upgrade voluntarily, so they will get some folk upgraded that way before they start mandating it to everyone.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  5.    17 Jun 2017 #5
    Join Date : Apr 2015
    Posts : 267
    Windows 10 Home x64 and Pro x86

    Thanks for the warning. I have an old upgraded XP that is almost-but-not-quite** Windows 10 compatible and, fortunately, its BIOS does have the ability to disable the Broadcom 440x.

    Ver 1607 runs without any problems other than the two annoyances** mentioned below. I intend to install Ver 1703 in the next week or two so I will disable the LAN card in the BIOS before I do so. I'll post back here if I learn anything useful.

    Denis

    ** [caregiver for a Dell Inspiron 9300 from October 2005] So far, the only drawbacks in Windows 10 have been that PowerCfg Battery Reports cannot be produced and Task scheduler cannot wake it from sleep despite all the normal settings being made. Turning off an unused LAN card will not be any great loss.
    Last edited by Try3; 17 Jun 2017 at 20:23.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  6.    22 Jun 2017 #6
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Posts : 1,393
    Windows 10 Pro (32-bit) 16299.15
    Thread Starter

    There's been an update over on the Microsoft Answers thread:
    Today we released a build that includes the fix for the Broadcom 440x. This fix was released to Windows Insiders who are signed up to receive prerelease builds on the "FAST" ring. For more information you can see this blog:

    https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexp...74uBzOxpHTx.97

    As I said this prerelease build has the fix to allow the Broadcom 440x to function as before. After we receive feedback from Windows Insiders to ensure that we are not breaking anything else we will look at including this in the Creators Update, which will go out to non windows insiders.

    I still cannot promise any dates or releases. But this is a big milestone.

    If any of you are windows insiders and have tried out this build let us know if it works or not. I have personally installed this build on a Dell Inspiron 9300 in my office, but it is great to get more feedback from the community.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  7.    22 Jun 2017 #7
    Join Date : Apr 2015
    Posts : 267
    Windows 10 Home x64 and Pro x86

    Thanks for the warning. I have an old upgraded XP that is almost-but-not-quite** Windows 10 compatible and, fortunately, its BIOS does have the ability to disable the Broadcom 440x.

    I disabled the Broadcom 440x in the BIOS & installed Ver 1703 this morning and everything is fine. No surprises at all [the two annoyances** continue, as they will until this venerable computer finally goes the way of all things].

    Denis

    ** [caregiver for a Dell Inspiron 9300 from October 2005] So far, the only drawbacks in Windows 10 have been that PowerCfg Battery Reports cannot be produced and Task scheduler cannot wake it from sleep despite all the normal settings being made. Turning off an unused LAN card will not be any great loss.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  8.    10 Jul 2017 #8
    Join Date : May 2015
    Posts : 139
    Windows 7 Home Premium x64

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post

    On the thread some people have got 1703 to install by disabling the ethernet hardware in their BIOS, but some computers (like mine) don't have that option.

    But I think the best course is to wait for Microsoft to issue a fix.
    what kind of computer are you using, DavidY?

    My mom's Dell Inspiron 640m/e1405 laptop has a BIOS option to disable/enable the integrated NIC controller for the Broadcom 440x LAN device. Also the integrated Broadcom 440x LAN controller is not only just for laptops, it's also featured on desktop PCs as well like the Dell Optiplex 320 & Dimension C521/E521.

    Looks like I'll upgrade to the upcoming Windows 10 fall creators update (1709) release when that one comes out next season, which is almost 3 months away and will skip the 1703 release. In the meantime, I'll stay with the anniversary update 1607 release since that version is working well.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  9.    10 Jul 2017 #9
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Posts : 1,393
    Windows 10 Pro (32-bit) 16299.15
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by erpster4 View Post
    what kind of computer are you using, DavidY?
    ....
    Looks like I'll upgrade to the upcoming Windows 10 fall creators update (1709) release when that one comes out next season, which is almost 3 months away and will skip the 1703 release. In the meantime, I'll stay with the anniversary update 1607 release since that version is working well.
    Mine's an Acer laptop, but no BIOS option unfortunately.

    Yes I'll probably end up skipping to the second Creators' Update as well. The machine needs a clean install in any case so I may as well wait until the next release and clean-install that one.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  10.    13 Jul 2017 #10
    Join Date : Oct 2016
    Posts : 91
    Windows 10 Pro x64

    Ugh...!! wish I had seen this last night, especially since I can disable the NIC in my BIOS. Describes exactly my problem, but it would've never occurred to me it was the Broadcom that screwed up all other network adapters.

    Anyway, I'll stick to my plan to go ahead with a dual boot of 1607 and 1703 so I can test the latter while continue to work on this computer.
      My ComputerSystem Spec

 
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