1.    26 Jan 2017 #1
    Join Date : Jan 2017
    Posts : 3
    Windows 10

    Getting my folks off using Symantec Ghost and going to SCCM 2012


    I'm not having an issue with Windows per say, I am just having an issue with the fact that my coworkers keep on using Symantec Ghost. I am in the process of building up an SCCM 2012 server and they keep insisting on using 1990's Symantec Ghost. What they do is get a computer, sometimes with a reused image and what they think is "refreshing" the image by downloading Windows Updates and installing new software, sometimes without uninstalling the old software. In which after, they copy the computer and make it as a image that they use to deploy all over the place at our company (happens to be a plastic extrusion facility). We've got images with the wrong model computer and they think, just because it runs okay, it will work. We have all kinds of activation and license issues, along with quirky issues that never seem to get resolved.

    I've went to trainings, did webinars, spent a lot of frustrating time on this SCCM and they are about interested in it as a kid is with a box of rocks.

    It is amazing how well SCCM does at deploying images and managing systems.

    In any event, any suggestions on getting my coworkers on board with properly deploying Windows?
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  2.    26 Jan 2017 #2
    Join Date : Jul 2016
    Crewe Cheshire
    Posts : 1,451
    windows 10

    Welcome to the forum. Its a wonder it still works I was abeta tester for ghost long before Norton got it thats 20 years ago. the problem was with the SID as everyone could end up with the same one meaning all pcs seem to be the one pc to somethings. You could show them this from ghost forum it wont work with ten so at some point they wont be able to use it and recover Ghost 15.0 on Windows 10 | Norton Community
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  3.    27 Jan 2017 #3
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 920
    Windows 10 Pro

    Well, I used SCCM at my job and it can do deployments, but it does take time and effort to get setup and managed. It also requires MS licensing which isn't cheap either. If SCCM seems too big or daunting, check out MDT with WDS. There is also a vendor called smart deploy that take the driver pack build hassle out and provide you with installable packs for your make and model.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  4.    28 Jan 2017 #4
    Join Date : Dec 2015
    Posts : 5,878
    Windows10

    Your real issue is people management ie users have rights to change stuff they should not have.

    You need to develop a proper deployment strategy. In you case, you probably need to consult a specialist - this forum is the last pace for such advice!
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  5.    28 Jan 2017 #5
    Join Date : Feb 2016
    Phoenix, AZ
    Posts : 243
    Windows 10 Pro 1709 16299.19

    Quote Originally Posted by blazer79 View Post
    I'm not having an issue with Windows per say, I am just having an issue with the fact that my coworkers keep on using Symantec Ghost. I am in the process of building up an SCCM 2012 server and they keep insisting on using 1990's Symantec Ghost. What they do is get a computer, sometimes with a reused image and what they think is "refreshing" the image by downloading Windows Updates and installing new software, sometimes without uninstalling the old software. In which after, they copy the computer and make it as a image that they use to deploy all over the place at our company (happens to be a plastic extrusion facility). We've got images with the wrong model computer and they think, just because it runs okay, it will work. We have all kinds of activation and license issues, along with quirky issues that never seem to get resolved.

    I've went to trainings, did webinars, spent a lot of frustrating time on this SCCM and they are about interested in it as a kid is with a box of rocks.

    It is amazing how well SCCM does at deploying images and managing systems.

    In any event, any suggestions on getting my coworkers on board with properly deploying Windows?

    Only one question "since he/she is a co-worker, why haven't you talked to your manager about this issue ?"
      My ComputersSystem Spec
  6.    28 Jan 2017 #6
    Join Date : Jan 2017
    Posts : 3
    Windows 10
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by storageman View Post
    Only one question "since he/she is a co-worker, why haven't you talked to your manager about this issue ?"
    You see, I have. I brought it up to one of my coworkers this week about ditching Ghost, and they turned around trying to push Ghost Solution Suite 3.1 onto my boss saying it's less hassle than SCCM and it's guaranteed to work. My next question to my coworker (didn't want to start a war, so I haven't pushed it), how the heck do you know it works?! Have you personally tried it in our environment? Just because it says "Ghost" in the name, doesn't mean it will work like the old version. I am sure there is just as much prep as there is in SCCM to get it working correctly -- assuming that this coworker knows as much as I do about the internal workings of Windows!

    It is just very frustrating, I got SCCM working, but no one wants to take the initiative to learn to use it!!

    Sometimes I love my job, but absolutely hate the people I work with, because they are stuck on old technology or doing thing their own way. Since they believe Ghost has worked in the past, that it is the only game in town. Which yeah, okay, we've got by all these years, but times have changed and I just want to do it right -- the Microsoft way.

    We've got a full blown MS licensing manager (trying to get away from MAK keys). I have used MDT and WDS, but the problem is control over our devices. We want to do software inventory, remote imaging and end-user software installation with approvals. Which takes it to the next step that MDT and WDS doesn't offer. Something which Ghost can't touch and isn't designed for.

    Cereberus -- I have spent lots of time and research on proper deployment strategies. I just want to refine it so it is less of a hassle to re-image computers. Using a genuine MS product for deployment of MS products only make sense. Having a 3rd party products seems rather inconsistent and foolish since we already pay for it in our MS Licensing contract.

    In any event, thanks for everyone's assistance, seems like a nice forum and sorry for venting...
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  7.    29 Jan 2017 #7
    Join Date : Jan 2017
    USA
    Posts : 18
    Windows 10

    This post just made me make a cup of coffee for the answer I will give you.

    Here are some fun facts:
    1. SCCM is paid for sound like. Updates are free. Works on all models. Yes, in order to create/maintain images and other functions of the product you need to learn it in depth (you in this case) but not the tech who simply wants to pxe boot and choose an image. As you mentioned about software management, queries, etc SCCM is made to be a one stop shop. Just FYI you can install MDT on to your SCCM and have integration to add all of the MDT functions added to your SCCM deployment if you wish.

    2. Your version of ghost is old and it will cost more $ to upgrade. Also Ghost is just copying a fat .wim file to the drive (Static Deployment). You cannot change anything about it. With SCCM you can perform a dynamic deployment and is a full end to end solution. WDS, Ghost, Acronis, etc is not an end to end solution.

    3. If you really have no one to manage your KMS server then I would keep MAK around and use it. You can manage all of your MAK keys from your computer only by using the Microsoft Volume Activation Tool which is included in the latest ADK10 and it is free.

    4. What you are trying to do I have been doing for a couple years so I should be able to answer other questions that you may have. I currently have my SCCM upgraded to 1610 (the latest) as of last Thursday and I really like the new software center.

    5. My best advice for you is to setup a stand alone MDT share to capture your reference images instead of using SCCM for capturing.
    A. it is faster.
    B. It is cleaner when done in a VM.
    C. You can simply import the .wim file you created with MDT into SCCM worry free.
    D. I would not use the built in patching feature to update your reference images in SCCM because it has been known to break your images.

    6. SCCM will allow you to have version control of all your software apps installed on the clients. This is very helpful in terms of standardization, licensing, and management. A good example is MS office. When it is time to renew your MS licensing you will need an accurate count of all the MS products. SCCM will allow you to handle this. Same goes for any other software.

    7. Remote imaging is also possible but for WOL (Wake on Lan) your network team will need to setup your switches accordingly.

    8. Client Computer Baselines. This is very helpful to ensure the right file is installed on all clients or version checking.

    9. Software deployments: Helps with mass deployments and/or removals when needed.

    10. It sound like you really need to show them how SCCM can make their job easier with automation.

    Feel free to msg me or post if questions.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  8.    08 Feb 2017 #8
    Join Date : Jan 2017
    Posts : 3
    Windows 10
    Thread Starter

    Thanks for the help. I've been trying my best to deal with the situation. I've mentioned to management that it is the best way to go. We have enough computers at our organization to justify it -- especially the automation part. I am looking forward to when savvy users are able to download their own software from our software manager and we can see what exactly is on each computer. Last week I found out our purchasing folks have been transferring credit card numbers via AOL AIM to one another! No one at the company should have AIM and common sense should've kicked in with someone who should have thought about some PCI compliance. Blows me away. I don't know how long they were doing it or how much they did.

    I've been doing #5 and also doing it with SCCM. So been doing it both ways. MDT works fine in most cases for our solutions. I just want to make it a simple unified solution to the "end user" Helpdesk tech -- yes, unfortunately, I have to classify some of our staff as just folks that think if they can install system board in a computer they think they are qualified for everything and don't want to learn anything new. I don't mind managing the back end, but I would love for one of them to step up and say "hey, I want to learn this!"... I just want to make it where one of our staff can just PXE boot in, select the computer "profile", fill in a couple questions, and then click begin. Or take it to the next level, and be able to re-image a person's computer remotely. I don't know how many days our folks just dread, I mean absolutely dread going outside to another building to have to re-image someone's computer when it's -10F outside or its a snowing blizzard. These are the key points where if I can get them to be on board, it would substantially help improve our users experience at work.
      My ComputerSystem Spec

 


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