Windows 10: Why doesn't Microsoft allow a clean Windows 10 install?

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  1.    17 Jun 2016 #1

    Why doesn't Microsoft allow a clean Windows 10 install?


    I'm confused. From what I am told, the validation of a Windows installation is stored in a PC's bios. By this fact, would not any windows installed on that PC, be allowed by virtue of it checking the validation from the bios? If so, then why is Microsoft forcing an upgrade of the current os, before you can do a clean install in another partition? First, as every 10 upgrade I have tried, have all failed, with the wonderful informational message "your upgrade failed"!!

    I would love to install a clean copy of 10 in a new partition with dual boot, bring this 10 up to date with everything I need for it to be my working os, and then remove the old 8.1. So would someone actually explain why Microsoft does not allow a free clean install that accesses the bios to confirm my PC is running a valid windows 8.1,?
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  2.    17 Jun 2016 #2

    Microsoft does allow clean install of Windows 10. If you have a product key for Windows 8 in your PC bios it will not even ask you for a product key or which version you want to install. It will just use the product key from bios to install and activate.

    If your computer does not have a Windows 8 or 10 product key in bios, then use this method :

    Clean Install Windows 10 Directly without having to Upgrade First
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  3.    17 Jun 2016 #3

    First, it violates the terms of the EULA to install a Windows 10 upgrade without deleting the installation of the previous OS. You are allowed to make a backup, but you cannot keep both installed at the same time.

    Second, the upgrade process uses a "digital entitlement" process that must validate the activated state of your current OS. If your PC was an OEM computer with an OEM license of Windows 8.1, then yes, the key for 8.1 is in your BIOS's firmware. More recent versions of Windows 10 allow you to enter your older key to create the digital entitlement but I believe this only works for retail copies (not oem). I could be wrong about that, if someone would correct me.

    There is also a rather simple process (not officially supported by Microsoft) defined here
    Clean Install Windows 10 Directly without having to Upgrade First - Windows 10 Forums
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  4.    17 Jun 2016 #4

    NavyLCDR said: View Post
    Microsoft does allow clean install of Windows 10. If you have a product key for Windows 8 in your PC bios it will not exen ask you for a product key or which version you want to install. It will just use the product key from bios to install and activate.
    If that's the case, then I stand corrected about that. However, I do believe you need to be installing at least the November update from ISO to do that (or from MCT)
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  5.    17 Jun 2016 #5

    Mystere said: View Post
    If that's the case, then I stand corrected about that. However, I do believe you need to be installing at least the November update from ISO to do that (or from MCT)
    Correct. The user must be installing build 10586.xxx - any build from the November update to now. This is the exact reason why some people who have upgraded their original Windows 8 computers from Home to Pro complain when they do a clean install of Windows 10 - because it will read the Windows 8 Core (home) product key in bios and install Windows 10 Home without asking if they want to install Home or Pro. Then they have to upgrade to Pro by entering the Windows 10 generic Pro product key, then activate it by changing the product key to their Windows 8 Pro upgrade product key.
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  6.    17 Jun 2016 #6

    Clean install of 10


    NavyLCDR said: View Post
    Correct. The user must be installing build 10586.xxx - any build from the November update to now. This is the exact reason why some people who have upgraded their original Windows 8 computers from Home to Pro complain when they do a clean install of Windows 10 - because it will read the Windows 8 Core (home) product key in bios and install Windows 10 Home without asking if they want to install Home or Pro. Then they have to upgrade to Pro by entering the Windows 10 generic Pro product key, then activate it by changing the product key to their Windows 8 Pro upgrade product key.
    I still don't understand why Microsoft makes it so hard to upgrade to 10, when someone has a valid copy of Windows installed (7 or 8.1). I followed the link to install a clean copy, but while reading it, there was a mention that it needs to be a clean install (replacing) the current os. I do not want to replace my 8.1 for now, but install 10 on a new partition with dual boot. Then after bringing my 10 up to a working os for me, then remove 8.1.
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  7.    17 Jun 2016 #7

    Coastalguy said: View Post
    I still don't understand why Microsoft makes it so hard to upgrade to 10, when someone has a valid copy of Windows installed (7 or 8.1). I followed the link to install a clean copy, but while reading it, there was a mention that it needs to be a clean install (replacing) the current os. I do not want to replace my 8.1 for now, but install 10 on a new partition with dual boot. Then after bringing my 10 up to a working os for me, then remove 8.1.
    You are getting an UPGRADE to Windows 10 for FREE. Is it really all that bad that Microsoft isn't just giving you a free copy of Windows 10 to do with what you want? That's like a car dealership giving you a Porsche for free and whining because it only has a 6 cylinder engine and not 8 cylinders. UPGRADE means that your previous installation of Windows ceases to exist because it was UPGRADED to Windows 10. If you want a separate and distinct copy of Windows 10 then buy it.

    Now, to come very close to what you want to do and stay legal, this is what I would suggest:
    Install Macrium Reflect Free. Make an image of your current Windows 8.1 onto an external hard drive. Do a clean install of Windows 10, erasing the current Windows 8.1 in the process. Install Macrium Reflect Free on the new Windows 10. Then you can browse the image you made on the external hard drive and retrieve the files you want from it.

    Macrium Reflect Free
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  8.    17 Jun 2016 #8

    Coastalguy said: View Post
    I still don't understand why Microsoft makes it so hard to upgrade to 10, when someone has a valid copy of Windows installed (7 or 8.1). I followed the link to install a clean copy, but while reading it, there was a mention that it needs to be a clean install (replacing) the current os. I do not want to replace my 8.1 for now, but install 10 on a new partition with dual boot. Then after bringing my 10 up to a working os for me, then remove 8.1.
    It is an UPGRADE, not a retail copy of windows. Upgrades have licensing restrictions, one of which is that you cannot have your old OS and Windows 10 installed simultaneously. It's the rules. If you don't like it, don't use the free upgrade. Buy a full retail copy.
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  9.    17 Jun 2016 #9

    NavyLCDR said: View Post
    That's like a car dealership giving you a Porsche for free and whining because it only has a 6 cylinder engine and not 8 cylinders.
    Actually, it's more like trading in your old car to get a discount on your new car, and then complaining that you can't keep both cars.
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  10.    17 Jun 2016 #10

    Sounds like you work for Microsoft


    NavyLCDR said: View Post
    You are getting an UPGRADE to Windows 10 for FREE. Is it really all that bad that Microsoft isn't just giving you a free copy of Windows 10 to do with what you want? That's like a car dealership giving you a Porsche for free and whining because it only has a 6 cylinder engine and not 8 cylinders. UPGRADE means that your previous installation of Windows ceases to exist because it was UPGRADED to Windows 10. If you want a separate and distinct copy of Windows 10 then buy it.

    Now, to come very close to what you want to do and stay legal, this is what I would suggest:
    Install Macrium Reflect Free. Make an image of your current Windows 8.1 onto an external hard drive. Do a clean install of Windows 10, erasing the current Windows 8.1 in the process. Install Macrium Reflect Free on the new Windows 10. Then you can browse the image you made on the external hard drive and retrieve the files you want from it.

    Macrium Reflect Free
    I wouldn't be asking this if my upgrade to my 8.1 and my wife's 7 didn't fail, regardless if I used the upgrade, a downloaded ISO and an ISO burned to a DVD. After spending weeks trying every method spouting on these forums and having them all fail, I question whether Microsoft really is interested in having everyone upgrade to 10. If they did, they sure would have made it easier, and provide a much better fail message than "The Upgrade Failed". Now, with every windows update, I have to make sure to uncheck that stupid KB so it doesn't reinstall that stupid script on my taskbar again and again and again.

    Also, I really don't give a rat's behind to update to 10, only that I know Microsoft will not support 8.1 eventually and that I will have to upgrade to 10. What I read was that Microsoft was trying to get everyone to 10, so that they would only have one os to support, thus reducing their overhead. So if they really wanted us on 10, then to their benefit, they should have made it so much easier, than to have a bunch of us fighting continual updates on our existing windows. I love my 8.1, except now they have infiltrated it with "forced" scripts that I have to continually remove.

    You say it's like trading in a used car and keeping both. No, it's like trading in a used car for a new one that is sitting on the top of Mount Everest, where you eventually give up trying to get to it, and eventually say the hell with it and settle back with your traded in used car.
    Last edited by Coastalguy; 17 Jun 2016 at 21:12.
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