What is the quality of upgrade I can expect from an in place upgrade?

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  1. Posts : 43
    Windows 10
       #1

    What is the quality of upgrade I can expect from an in place upgrade?


    I know the question is a little vague in the title but Iím not sure how to ask the question in short any other way. Unabridged: I am a firm believer that a fresh install is the best and cleanest way to go, and typically I like to do a clean install once a year... Iíve gone about 2 and a half years now without a clean install but my problem is, I have some apps that were discontinued and if I reinstall, the web login system not only wonít work, itís nonexistent. I think it just cashed my license on the computer so itís still working. Long story short I donít want to lose those applications... but I also am noticing some pretty serious performance issues and the amount of background services running are running me dry. Even with 32gb of ram (maybe 64, I donít even remember anymore) and 2 Gtx 1080 ti cards Iím noticing lagging in graphics and caching speeds in different graphics intense applications. Issues that only 6 months ago were barely noticeable are now reminding me of a computer 2010 (Exaggerating).

    All of that said, do you feel an in place upgrade might make any difference at all, if I tell it to keep my apps will it help with background services that have been collecting for years that are unrelated to anything actively installed, and would an in place upgrade affect my licenses (theoretically... cuz I donít know where or how specifically the apps are storing the license data)?

    Thanks for the help!😊
      My Computer


  2. Posts : 38,542
    windows 10 professional version 1607 build 14393.969 64 bit
       #2

    Update the specs in the "My Computer" section:

    System Specs - Fill in at Ten Forums
    In the left corner below in your post you find 'My System Specs'.
    After clicking it you can find a link a little below that says 'Update your System Spec', click on this link to get to the page where you can fill in your system specs.
    System Info - See Your System Specs - Windows 7 Help Forums

    Include PSU. cooler, case, peripherals and anything attached to the computer by wired or wireless (mouse, keyboard, headset, printer, xbox, USB wireless network card, etc.)

    https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials


    Consider performing steps now to check operating system, component store, drive file system, drive, software conflicts, etc.
    Then upgrade.
    If problems persist then refresh, reset save files, custom install, or clean install.

    1) Open administrative command prompt and type or copy and paste:
    2) sfc /scannow
    3) dism /online /cleanup-image /scanhealth
    4) dism /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth
    5) sfc /scannow
    6) chkdsk /scan
    7) wmic recoveros set autoreboot = false
    8) wmic recoveros set DebugInfoType = 7
    9) wmic recoveros get autoreboot
    10) wmic recoveros get DebugInfoType
    11) bcdedit /enum {badmemory}

    12) When these have completed > right click on the top bar or title bar of the administrative command prompt box > left click on edit then select all > right click on the top bar again > left click on edit then copy > paste into the thread

    Use this link as needed when posting results:
    How to Change Post Editor to Source or WYSIWYG Mode at TenForums.com


    13) Make sure that there is no over clocking while troubleshooting

    14) In the left lower corner search type: system or system control > open system control panel > on the left pane click advanced system settings

    a) > on the advanced tab under startup and recovery > click settings > post an image of the startup and recovery window into the thread

    b) > on the advanced tab under performance > click on settings > on the performance options window > click on the advanced tab > under virtual memory > click on change > post an image of the virtual memory window into the thread

    16) If the computer has Ccleaner (do not install the software if it is not already installed) > click windows tab or custom clean > scroll down to system and advanced > post an image into the thread

    17) Run HD Tune (free version) (all drives)
    HD Tune website
    Post images into the thread for results on these tabs:
    a) Health
    b) Benchmark
    c) Full error scan

    18) Run Sea Tools for Windows
    long generic test
    Post an image of the test result into the thread
    SeaTools for Windows |
    Seagate

    How to use SeaTools for Windows | Seagate Support US

    19) There are log collectors used in another forum room.
    Run each V2 and DM and upload directly into this thread:
    BSOD - Posting Instructions

    20) Place the computer in clean boot and report changes in boot and performance:
    Perform a Clean Boot in Windows 10 to Troubleshoot Software Conflicts



    Take Screenshot in Windows 10
    https://support.microsoft.com/en-gb/...re-screenshots
    How to Upload and Post Screenshots and Files at Ten Forums
      My Computer

  3. ignatzatsonic's Avatar
    Posts : 2,453
    Windows 10 Home, 64-bit
       #3

    Thornton said:
    Long story short I don’t want to lose those applications... 
    I found out the day before yesterday that you cannot rely on an "in place upgrade" to leave ALL previously installed applications untouched.

    There is some risk.......so obviously take measures to deal with that. Such as reverting to a previous state or finding alternate replacement applications.
      My Computer


  4. Posts : 43
    Windows 10
    Thread Starter
       #4

    zbook said:
    Update the specs in the "My Computer" section:

    System Specs - Fill in at Ten Forums
    In the left corner below in your post you find 'My System Specs'.
    After clicking it you can find a link a little below that says 'Update your System Spec', click on this link to get to the page where you can fill in your system specs.
    System Info - See Your System Specs - Windows 7 Help Forums

    Include PSU. cooler, case, peripherals and anything attached to the computer by wired or wireless (mouse, keyboard, headset, printer, xbox, USB wireless network card, etc.)

    https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials


    Consider performing steps now to check operating system, component store, drive file system, drive, software conflicts, etc.
    Then upgrade.
    If problems persist then refresh, reset save files, custom install, or clean install.

    1) Open administrative command prompt and type or copy and paste:
    2) sfc /scannow
    3) dism /online /cleanup-image /scanhealth
    4) dism /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth
    5) sfc /scannow
    6) chkdsk /scan
    7) wmic recoveros set autoreboot = false
    8) wmic recoveros set DebugInfoType = 7
    9) wmic recoveros get autoreboot
    10) wmic recoveros get DebugInfoType
    11) bcdedit /enum {badmemory}

    12) When these have completed > right click on the top bar or title bar of the administrative command prompt box > left click on edit then select all > right click on the top bar again > left click on edit then copy > paste into the thread

    Use this link as needed when posting results:
    How to Change Post Editor to Source or WYSIWYG Mode at TenForums.com


    13) Make sure that there is no over clocking while troubleshooting

    14) In the left lower corner search type: system or system control > open system control panel > on the left pane click advanced system settings

    a) > on the advanced tab under startup and recovery > click settings > post an image of the startup and recovery window into the thread

    b) > on the advanced tab under performance > click on settings > on the performance options window > click on the advanced tab > under virtual memory > click on change > post an image of the virtual memory window into the thread

    16) If the computer has Ccleaner (do not install the software if it is not already installed) > click windows tab or custom clean > scroll down to system and advanced > post an image into the thread

    17) Run HD Tune (free version) (all drives)
    HD Tune website
    Post images into the thread for results on these tabs:
    a) Health
    b) Benchmark
    c) Full error scan

    18) Run Sea Tools for Windows
    long generic test
    Post an image of the test result into the thread
    SeaTools for Windows |
    Seagate

    How to use SeaTools for Windows | Seagate Support US

    19) There are log collectors used in another forum room.
    Run each V2 and DM and upload directly into this thread:
    BSOD - Posting Instructions

    20) Place the computer in clean boot and report changes in boot and performance:
    Perform a Clean Boot in Windows 10 to Troubleshoot Software Conflicts



    Take Screenshot in Windows 10
    https://support.microsoft.com/en-gb/...re-screenshots
    How to Upload and Post Screenshots and Files at Ten Forums
    That's quite a list. Ill take a look for sure. Havn't done some solid trouble shooting in a while, but my big concern right now is a little less troubleshooting the problem and a little more just trying to reinstall and keep things... Many of the software I use cache gigabytes of data at a time and run countless tasks and in my experience, clearing the disk cache doesn't always get rid of all the cached data and uninstalling the app doesn't get rid of all of the services and tasks, and a lot of the cached files are stored in hidden folders buried deep in the dark depths of windows only knows where. Fresh installs have never failed to fix this issue, which is logical. In this rare instance, my hands are tied with some things because I am using some applications from like 2013 that became paid later and I have no desire to pay for a newer version when I know how to use the old one, or other applications where the license only works by a grace of god.

    I am hoping to find a happy medium where I can have (at least some) of the best of both worlds. Declutter a bit and still keep the important stuff.

    - - - Updated - - -

    ignatzatsonic said:
    I found out the day before yesterday that you cannot rely on an "in place upgrade" to leave ALL previously installed applications untouched.
    There is some risk.......so obviously take measures to deal with that. Such as reverting to a previous state or finding alternate replacement applications.
    I actually didnt even know this was possible until a few hours ago so knowing there is a chance is awesome. TBH I am not AS concerned with the older software that I cant replace. That would suck but theres options. I am a bit more concerned with a few licenses that are only valid once if you dont pay for a physical copy of the software so I would have to pay a ""relicensing fee"" of $50 per to get a new one. That said, im really not trying to pay another $150 for $2000 worth of software.

    On a different note, besides leaving ALL the previously installed applications untouched, do you believe this process would be in any way comparable to a clean install where I then reinstalled everything, in terms of a performance increase. Again, I know thats one of those questions where its like, well, without looking at it I cant say for sure, but just in general, does this typically carry some of the same performance resolutions as a clean install or is it more like a system repair that fixes things and if something was broken it will be faster but in general, probably not much to write home about?
      My Computer

  5. ignatzatsonic's Avatar
    Posts : 2,453
    Windows 10 Home, 64-bit
       #5

    Thornton said:

    ...............does this typically carry some of the same performance resolutions as a clean install or is it more like a system repair that fixes things and if something was broken it will be faster but in general, probably not much to write home about?
    Difficult to say.........I'm not sure there is a meaningful difference between what you state before the word "or" and what you state after the word "or"............as regards performance.

    I generally don't do clean installs because of performance issues. I do them when I make major changes in hardware (motherboard and CPU).

    I did an "in place upgrade" a couple of days ago only because I was bored and did not want to wait for Windows Update. I knew the upgrade would be forced on me sooner or later, so I chose sooner out of boredom and my famed inability to leave well enough alone.

    I did NOT do the upgrade for any reason related to performance and cannot detect any performance differences.

    Major upgrades such as 2004 are a pain because at a minimum you are forced to go back and reconfigure a bunch of stuff that was previously configured perfectly. As far as I know, there is no way out of that and we are at the mercy of Microsoft.
      My Computer


  6. Posts : 43
    Windows 10
    Thread Starter
       #6

    ignatzatsonic said:
    Difficult to say.........I'm not sure there is a meaningful difference between what you state before the word "or" and what you state after the word "or"............as regards performance.

    I generally don't do clean installs because of performance issues. I do them when I make major changes in hardware (motherboard and CPU).

    I did an "in place upgrade" a couple of days ago only because I was bored and did not want to wait for Windows Update. I knew the upgrade would be forced on me sooner or later, so I chose sooner out of boredom and my famed inability to leave well enough alone.

    I did NOT do the upgrade for any reason related to performance and cannot detect any performance differences.

    Major upgrades such as 2004 are a pain because at a minimum you are forced to go back and reconfigure a bunch of stuff that was previously configured perfectly. As far as I know, there is no way out of that and we are at the mercy of Microsoft.
    well I appreciate the honesty in the response. All of that said then, not to undermine zbook up above but what are your thoughts on that method of troubleshooting? In all honesty, my main focus is getting this machine back to full speed. a 4770k, 1080ti, and 32gb of ram and windows booting off an SSD built in 2017 should not not feel slower than my 2015 mac book with 16 gb of ram and a gtx 750m... and it never was until around 6 months ago. It wasn't an over night thing, just sorta slowly got worse and worse.
      My Computer

  7. ignatzatsonic's Avatar
    Posts : 2,453
    Windows 10 Home, 64-bit
       #7

    Thornton said:
    what are your thoughts on that method of troubleshooting.....................a 4770k, 1080ti, and 32gb of ram and windows booting off an SSD should not not feel slower than my 2015 mac book with 16 gb of ram and a gtx 750m... and it never was until around 6 months ago. It wasn't an over night thing, just sorta slowly got worse and worse...............
    It's an understandable dilemma.

    Troubleshooting typically leads down a number of rabbit holes that prove to be a waste of time. Maybe 2 hours, maybe 200.

    Like a gambler at a slot machine, after you've spent 2 hours, you may be reluctant to give up on trouble-shooting and insist on dropping even more silver dollars into the machine. With a slot machine, at least you know you will eventually hit a jackpot if you play long enough. Not so with trouble-shooting.

    Most likely, you have a rough idea of how much agony (in hours) you would spend on a clean install and re-configuration. Unlike trouble-shooting.

    Then factor in the possibility that you have hardware going bad, which a clean install would not alleviate. More uncertainty.

    When in doubt, I tend to bite bullets and so would lean toward a clean install after going down a limited number of rabbit holes. That speaks to my frustration tolerance, not yours. Maybe you have a high threshold.

    Frankly, I don't see how you can make a so-called rational choice. You can't know in advance the likelihood of trouble-shooting success.

    Flip a coin and be willing to be wrong.
      My Computer


  8. Posts : 43
    Windows 10
    Thread Starter
       #8

    ignatzatsonic said:
    It's an understandable dilemma.

    Troubleshooting typically leads down a number of rabbit holes that prove to be a waste of time. Maybe 2 hours, maybe 200.

    Like a gambler at a slot machine, after you've spent 2 hours, you may be reluctant to give up on trouble-shooting and insist on dropping even more silver dollars into the machine. With a slot machine, at least you know you will eventually hit a jackpot if you play long enough. Not so with trouble-shooting.

    Most likely, you have a rough idea of how much agony (in hours) you would spend on a clean install and re-configuration. Unlike trouble-shooting.

    Then factor in the possibility that you have hardware going bad, which a clean install would not alleviate. More uncertainty.

    When in doubt, I tend to bite bullets and so would lean toward a clean install after going down a limited number of rabbit holes. That speaks to my frustration tolerance, not yours. Maybe you have a high threshold.

    Frankly, I don't see how you can make a so-called rational choice. You can't know in advance the likelihood of trouble-shooting success.

    Flip a coin and be willing to be wrong.
    Welp, sounds good to me. Thankfully I dont think any of my hardware is going bad but I could boot my other license of windows up on an external drive and try and get a good view of if the major applications I use are performing better. If not then its probably hardware related.

    Besides that more obvious solution, do you have your own preferred way of troubleshooting. Ive done tens of them and like you said it tends to be a rabit hole that leads to others. Never tried one method that felt ""easier"" per se but if there is a certain process for troubleshooting you recommend, Im all eyes.
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  9. ignatzatsonic's Avatar
    Posts : 2,453
    Windows 10 Home, 64-bit
       #9

    Thornton said:
    ................do you have your own preferred way of troubleshooting...........
    None beyond the obvious:

    Try to ensure there are no hardware issues via RAM and disk testing.

    Try to ensure viruses and malware are not at play.

    Peer at Task Manager for a while, as if doing so decreased my bewilderment.

    Ponder the software and config changes I may have made since things began to go south.

    Consider System Restore points if available. It has bailed me out dozens of times, but not recently.

    All the while the clock is ticking on my blood pressure and RAGE..............which in recent years has meant that soon enough I throw in the towel and restore a previously made Macrium image.

    If, ten minutes from now, I suddenly was in a new and inexplicable jam, I'd probably restore an image within an hour or two. I assume that is not available to you.
      My Computer


  10. Posts : 43
    Windows 10
    Thread Starter
       #10

    ignatzatsonic said:
    None beyond the obvious:

    Try to ensure there are no hardware issues via RAM and disk testing.

    Try to ensure viruses and malware are not at play.

    Ponder the software and config changes I may have made since things began to go south.

    Consider System Restore points if available. It has bailed me out dozens of times, but not recently.

    All the while the clock is ticking on my blood pressure and RAGE..............which in recent years has meant that soon enough I throw in the towel and restore a previously made Macrium image.

    If, ten minutes from now, I suddenly was in a new and inexplicable jam, I'd probably restore an image within an hour or two. I assume that is not available to you.
    I dont keep anything older than a few months at a time and even if I did, anything that old, I might as well just start from scratch. So much of my software configurations would be gone anyway, might as well just go by what I need as I need it and cough up the few hundred bucks and look for some new tools where my old ones are goners.
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