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  1.    21 Oct 2014 #51
    Join Date : Oct 2014
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    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slartybart View Post
    Because Win10 is a preview release, I'm concerned that something might not work.

    The HP PC Hardware 3-in-1 key would take Win10 out of the equation bc it's a self booting key. A thought just occurred to me that you might have difficulty even creating the key on Win10 ... if you go that route, you might want to create the key on the other machine.

    Another thought occurred to me - to be on the safe side, put the HD (Win8?) back in the laptop and flash with that OS running. That would be safer than depending on Win10 with whatever MS decided to lock down for the preview.

    The 3-in-1 key wouldn't be necessary if you flash BIOS with Win8 HDD booted, just download F.49 and launch it.
    Wish I thought of that earlier.

    Bill
    .
    Actually, Windows 8 isn't supported either. When I checked on drivers (looking for the BIOS), I was told I didn't have Windows XP, Vista or Windows 7 installed.

    So I clicked on the link you provided for F.49 and nothing about operating system was noted. I'm pretty sure that if an OS were linked to a BIOS flash, I would have been asked to give my OS.

    Another thing is that the tool is UEFI. The laptop is total legacy . . . there is no way to get UEFI BIOS on it that I can see. So I'm wondering if I really want to use it on the laptop. However, it would, without a doubt, be useful for the 500-056 desktop.

    As to creating the key, I would definitely have to create it on the desktop, since Lappy is legacy and would probably barf if I tried that.
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  2.    21 Oct 2014 #52
    Join Date : Oct 2014
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    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slartybart View Post
    Twiddling my thumbs while HP downloads the utility. It isn't that big (2 GB) - HP must be really slow today.

    http://www.patriotmemory.com/product...d=8301&type=17

    I didn't see any firmware updates, but you should verify that I looked at the correct device and double check what I looked for - my eyes aren't that good anymore

    Bill
    .
    I was taken round and round and round and never found any updates for the Patriot Blaze 240 GB SSD. Not spending any more time on that. I saw a blurb that said if you don't see firmware update it's not needed.
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  3.    21 Oct 2014 #53
    Join Date : Oct 2013
    Penns Forrest
    Posts : 3,506
    Win_8.1-Pro, Win_10.1607-Pro, Mint_17.3

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    Actually, Windows 8 isn't supported either. When I checked on drivers (looking for the BIOS), I was told I didn't have Windows XP, Vista or Windows 7 installed.

    So I clicked on the link you provided for F.49 and nothing about operating system was noted. I'm pretty sure that if an OS were linked to a BIOS flash, I would have been asked to give my OS.

    Another thing is that the tool is UEFI. The laptop is total legacy . . . there is no way to get UEFI BIOS on it that I can see. So I'm wondering if I really want to use it on the laptop. However, it would, without a doubt, be useful for the 500-056 desktop.

    As to creating the key, I would definitely have to create it on the desktop, since Lappy is legacy and would probably barf if I tried that.
    Isn't supported where? HP drivers page?

    Yeah, mfgrs stop listing OSes after a year or more, HP even stops listing driver updates on the product page. There are updates on HP (on their ftp servers) but they aren't listed - so you have to find them.

    Win7 was pretty good at supplying drivers and Win8 is fully driver aware. The mfgrs provide MS with the driver and then they get certified by WHQL. MS just makes it easier to get the driver since they already have it and certified it. If Widows Update supplies the driver in Win8, that's all you need. It might not be the most current, but that's ok - it's the best that MS has tested with the OS.

    Drivers are listed in the optional offerings in WU, so you might have to manually check for them.

    BIOS/Firmware is OS independent - the code gets loaded at when the machine starts ... before the OS.
    Any OS dependencies exists only with the method of unpacking the download. Firmware is tied to the Mobo, CPU and other hardware. It's what makes hardware available to the OS.

    The 3-in-1 key carries it's own boot structure - it's a technicians tool. I do not have UEFI set up on this machine (although I've tried a few times) and the key was created with the UEFI schema - pretty cool. Your machine is on that precarious mfgr date line - did HP include support when your machine was manufactured or the next day. That's more research than it's worth. For the most part, you can depend on the HP support page to provide the drivers necessary for the operation of your machine.

    If you flash the firmware with Win8 booted, the 3-in-1 key will not be necessary . That was a precautionary step to get Win10 out of the equation which turned out to be more difficult than it's worth in time due to HP's poor documentation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wynona View Post
    I was taken round and round and round and never found any updates for the Patriot Blaze 240 GB SSD. Not spending any more time on that. I saw a blurb that said if you don't see firmware update it's not needed.
    Same thing I saw, just wanted you to double check since it's your machine.



    Since the issue was present on Win8.1, I'd like to keep the HDD in the machine while we trouble shoot the issue. If it's resolved with Win8.1 it should be resolved when you put the SSD back in.

    This will give you a real OS to use (no utility not running issues). Once the dbl boot is resolved, you can play with Win10 to your hearts content

    I type too slow and look for supporting information or try to think of resolutions/tests/data needed as I type.

    You're probably way a head of me and the firmware is already updated. Maybe the issue has been tested with the updated firmware and you've already marked this thread solved

    Bill
    .
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  4.    21 Oct 2014 #54
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    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
    Thread Starter

    Nah, not marked as solved by any stretch. Although I'm a reasonably fast typist, I am much slower to jump into the water to see if it's warm enough. Because I don't want to get caught doing something I shouldn't have.

    I clicked on another link to BIOS you supplied and it did mention OS versions, Win 7 being the latest supported.

    There's a little computer shop right up the road from me and I will go up there and ask if they have a used 2.5" SATA drive for the laptop. Doesn't have to be all that big because I'll plug it into the laptop and install Windows 7 on it. I have two or three copies I no longer use, so no expense there.

    That way I'll be as safe as I can possibly be.
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  5.    21 Oct 2014 #55
    Join Date : Oct 2013
    Penns Forrest
    Posts : 3,506
    Win_8.1-Pro, Win_10.1607-Pro, Mint_17.3

    Fair enough - your machine ... your decision

    Do me one favor? When you reference something, give me the reference. I am helping other members and playing with Win10 on my own machine. Of the 60 or more bookmarks I added for the issue on your thread, I can't respond to I clicked on another link to BIOS you supplied and it did mention OS versions, Win 7 being the latest supported.

    If you provide the link, I can look at it to see if it's a real concern or if it's an omission. As I mentioned HP isn't isn't the best when it comes to updating documentation. I followed so many dead links researching the 3-in-1 key that I'm amazed HP stays in the consumer PC business. This is not the only case I ran into HP site research - there's lots of it.
    Don't worry about back filling - just a note for future conversations.

    Thanks - by the way, did I say you're doing great?
    No? Well then ... you're doing great!

    Bill
    .
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  6.    21 Oct 2014 #56
    Join Date : Oct 2014
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    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slartybart View Post
    Fair enough - your machine ... your decision
    I think this will be the simplest way to finish this off unless you find from reading the link I provided below that it'll be completely safe to flash the BIOS with 8.1.1 installed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slartybart View Post
    Do me one favor? When you reference something, give me the reference. I am helping other members and playing with Win10 on my own machine. Of the 60 or more bookmarks I added for the issue on your thread, I can't respond to I clicked on another link to BIOS you supplied and it did mention OS versions, Win 7 being the latest supported.

    If you provide the link, I can look at it to see if it's a real concern or if it's an omission.
    Here ya go . . .

    http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/s...860630&sw_lang=

    Quote Originally Posted by Slartybart View Post
    As I mentioned HP isn't isn't the best when it comes to updating documentation. I followed so many dead links researching the 3-in-1 key that I'm amazed HP stays in the consumer PC business. This is not the only case I ran into HP site research - there's lots of it.
    HP isn't the only one!

    We'll git 'er done one way or the other.
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  7.    21 Oct 2014 #57

    If nothing else works I would want to compare to a Legacy BIOS install to wiped HD.

    Is Secure Boot still engaged?
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  8.    21 Oct 2014 #58
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    Penns Forrest
    Posts : 3,506
    Win_8.1-Pro, Win_10.1607-Pro, Mint_17.3

    Thanks, yeah ... that's HP's way of saying 'we will only support this configuration'
    They back pedal even more here: What if I Don't See My Operating System? | HP® Support

    There they say
    "If you upgrade to another OS, you're on your own for drivers.
    See the mfgr's site if you need a driver (graphics driver - see Nvidia or AMD ... BT driver see Broadcom...)."

    The only caveat on that page is about BIOS. HP might have legitimate claims for firmware - they might have modified it for their board configuration. The caveat isn't about upgrading, it's about where you get the upgrade (only from HP and I agree with that).

    Quote Originally Posted by HP Consumer Support
    CAUTION: Do not install BIOS updates from the motherboard manufacturer's Web site!
    Only install BIOS updates from HP!
    Installing BIOS updates from the motherboard manufacturer's Web site can prevent the computer from accepting an HP System Recovery.
    Well your system is far beyond System Recovery (Vista).

    I think the flash on Win8 would be fine. There never are guarantees though.

    If you feel more comfortable with a Win7 drive, sure that should work too.

    The decision always falls back to you, I'm just a guide, you're leading this safari

    You're right, it's not just HP, but they excel at it

    I do like your CanDo attitude. I hope that after all of this the issue is resolved., there isn't much left to try. But try we will!

    Bill
    .
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  9.    21 Oct 2014 #59
    Join Date : Oct 2014
    Posts : 17,111
    Windows 10 Insider Preview Build 16281
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by Slartybart View Post
    Thanks, yeah ... that's HP's way of saying 'we will only support this configuration'
    They back pedal even more here: What if I Don't See My Operating System? | HP® Support

    There they say
    "If you upgrade to another OS, you're on your own for drivers.
    See the mfgr's site if you need a driver (graphics driver - see Nvidia or AMD ... BT driver see Broadcom...)."

    The only caveat on that page is about BIOS. HP might have legitimate claims for firmware - they might have modified it for their board configuration. The caveat isn't about upgrading, it's about where you get the upgrade (only from HP and I agree with that).

    Quote Originally Posted by HP Consumer Support
    CAUTION: Do not install BIOS updates from the motherboard manufacturer's Web site!
    Only install BIOS updates from HP!
    Installing BIOS updates from the motherboard manufacturer's Web site can prevent the computer from accepting an HP System Recovery.
    Well your system is far beyond System Recovery (Vista).

    I think the flash on Win8 would be fine. There never are guarantees though.

    If you feel more comfortable with a Win7 drive, sure that should work too.

    The decision always falls back to you, I'm just a guide, you're leading this safari

    You're right, it's not just HP, but they excel at it

    I do like your CanDo attitude. I hope that after all of this the issue is resolved., there isn't much left to try. But try we will!

    Bill
    .
    I've seen "What if I don't see my operating system" which is why I began to backpedal. I have never flashed a BIOS except from the original manufacturer. The few flashes I have done have been on motherboards of systems I have built. Still, I will only flash the BIOS from HP because I am well award that every OEM changes things around to suit themselves. I believe they even order their mobos with specific features added or left off.

    Ha! This desktop was beyond System Recovery once I had updated to 8.1 from the MS Store. I had to send it back to HP for recovery while it was in the first 30 days of warranty! And when I got it back, the OS was only half-baked and I had to call support to finish the installation! Grrrrrrrrr!

    I just ordered a WD Blue 500 GB for $44.99. Newegg had a promo of $5.00 off $49.99, so that was good. It will be here in a few days, but in the meantime, I'm going to scavenge the hard drive from my Pavilion g Series and install Windows 7 on it.

    I think first, though, I'll have to use CopyWipe on it, since it's been my experience that an older OS won't install on a hard drive once a newer OS has been on it. Don't know why that is, but well . . . junk happens.
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  10.    21 Oct 2014 #60

    First I'd reset BIOS to defaults, disable Secure Boot, set CSM enabled, turn off any related UEFI settings, boot Legacy installation media as a non-UEFI device.

    If you have pics I can usually spot the germane settings as there are a dozen of these UEFI install issues a day at 7F, every day of the year.

    Wiping the HD with Clean CMD is all that's needed to overcome any interfering boot code and clears the partition table.
      My ComputerSystem Spec

 
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