Windows 10 over GNU/Linux because of creation time support

Hello Windows users,

I have been using Windows for more than 1 decade and I like Windows system because it shows creation time for file/folder. Additionally, the timestamp creation time (Windows Explorer shows as name "Date Created") can be kept with other file manager software or robocopy.exe for file/folder.

Many users say the future should be GNU/Linux, I can't confirm that, I used a Linux disteubation for the first time and at the first use I noticed immediately that there is no way to show the creation time in standard file manager or many other file managers on Linux show it, but there is no way to keep or save the creation time when copying file/folder.

This is fully backward Linux is outdated in my eyes. Fortunately I stopped the experiment, I can recommend for Windows users if creation time for file/folder is important and always want to keep or change afterwards (for example wrong timestamp) keep using Windows system.

There is a lot of software on Windows that can save or change creation time.

On Linux there is none and according to my short research this is a general Linux problem, so a user unfriendly design decision.

Here are the facts: Since Windows XP I know creation time for file/folder and that was year 2001 until today 2021 with Windows 10 it works like the first day I use Windows.

Linux in 2021 can not do it until today. For me only a limited operating system. Windows in this case has more freedom for users.

Posix standards dont require the creation time to be stored. You can optionally set flags to capture it with ext4, but it's not a default.

Linux and windows are very different. I have been working with and managing linux servers since 1999. I have been using windows since the mid 80s.

Linux offers way more freedoms though. For example, can you recompile your Windows kernel for performance optimizations?....nope. can you change your windows manager to a lighter weight option for lower end computers?....nope. Are you provided the source code to modify your system in any way you see fit? Nope. Can you run without a gui? Nope, not on windows 10 (you can on a server). 99.995% of my linux machines dont have a gui.


Linux runs on a huge number of devices, from routers, to kiosk terminals, to raspberry pi's, to data centers, etc.

I'm not saying windows is bad, but in your limited experience you don't really have a good grasp on how to evaluate it as a platform. That comes with time.

This is about creation time and not about other topics.

The facts here clearly show that Linux cannot keep creation time.

I have tested many Linux distributions and each one has a different behaviour, some show creation time but do not keep creation time when the user wants them to. Why this display in the standard file manager at all if there is no use for the user? How can a user for example keep the creation time of his data from an external hard disk to a Linux distribution and that with a GUI software.

It is not possible and there is no possibility at all on Linux. I have researched for a long time and there is no solution.

Windows has supported this for more than a decade, since Windows XP for consumers. I use for example Multi Commander or robocopy.exe very easy and no problems. In addition, I can even display the nanoseconds of NTFS file system in Multi Commander.

Besides, your other points are not really a feature on Linux. Linux is just an operating system like Windows.

That Windows, for example, can't do your points has more of an economic reason, because of the Microsoft corporation. It is not a technical problem.

Microsoft would have to change and just make Windows completely open source and ask masses of developers around the world for help and provide an open platform and most of your points are solved.

Windows has the biggest advantage from the user's point of view, there is a lot of software (GUI) that has already been created for many user's interest for decades. Maybe Microsoft will change their strategy and finally become more open and adult.

berunhiaaoqn918 said:

This is about creation time and not about other topics. The facts here clearly show that Linux cannot keep creation time.

I am a CentOS/Redhat user. I can query a file for the crtime with
sudo debugfs -R ‘stat /bin/ls’ /dev/xvda1



I've never really missed seeing the creation time of a file. Backups to an external hard drive have always worked great for me using rsync. It offers to me what robocop does for me in Windows.qq

berunhiaaoqn918 said:

Windows has the biggest advantage from the user's point of view, there is a lot of software (GUI) that has already been created for many user's interest for decades.

And so does unix/linux, just not necessarily for the desktop markets. Apps like Apache (web server), Bind (dns server), postfix (mail server) are the defacto standards on the Internet and have been since the internet existed.

Like i said, still a windows fan and enthusiast and hence my participation on this forum. My gaming machine runs Windows because it's the right tool for the job. My laptop is a mac, my servers are a mix of Linux and Windows, I use android phones,etc. They all have places.

pparks1 is absolutely right! I have run Linux on my main desktop for many, many years. We also have a Windows gaming system, each has their strengths.

To succeed with Linux you have to loose the Windows mindset, they are completely different. The same would be true for someone trying Windows after only running Linux.

pparks1 touched on just a few things you could do with Linux, there are many more!

Read the thread again completely Linux cannot keep creation time. I have said it several times and have also found other problems in general from the user's point of view.

You don't need to show me how to display creation time on Linux with a manual terminal command. I'm not looking for it and I've just stated the facts here, nothing more or less. Besides, you can clearly see that I want to use user friendly operating systems and typical user software (GUI) and not any scripts or manual terminal commands.

Also, your off topic do not belong here and I ask you to stop.

I don't like this competition, a typical male dominated society.

It's always more harmonious to show the solutions that the user is looking for, if they don't exist then please don't ruin or spam the thread here.

Berun,

I thought you were a crazy person. How in the world could Linux exist after all this years and somehow not include the creation date of a file. And so I --

1. Went into Recovery Options
2. Booted into my trusty Zorin Thumb Drive
3. Created a folder on the desktop and --
3a. -- son of a b!tch --
4. -- there was no dated created info.

WTF! I feel your pain.

berunhiaaoqn918 said:

Read the thread again completely Linux cannot keep creation time. I have said it several times and have also found other problems in general from the user's point of view.

all systems will have some type of problem from somebodies point of view. Linux is not for everyone. This doesn’t make it a bad tool, just maybe not the right tool for the job.

berunhiaaoqn918 said:

You don't need to show me how to display creation time on Linux with a manual terminal command. I'm not looking for it and I've just stated the facts here, nothing more or less. Besides, you can clearly see that I want to use user friendly operating systems and typical user software (GUI) and not any scripts or manual terminal commands.

sorry, terminal is pretty much how I have used Linux in my career. Just because it’s in the terminal doesn’t mean it’s not user friendly. I could give you a list of commands and you could cut and paste them and get exactly what I want. Compare to windows where I would say, click here, then click here, click on this tab, scroll down to this section, click on properties, then go to advanced..click the radio button, them click apply, hit ok, ok, ok and then close the window.

berunhiaaoqn918 said:

Also, your off topic do not belong here and I ask you to stop.
I don't like this competition, a typical male dominated society.

it’s a public forum, I’m being polite and stating a differing opinion to your own.

this is in no way a competition. It’s an opportunity for us to discuss options and learn along the way.

berunhiaaoqn918 said:

It's always more harmonious to show the solutions that the user is looking for, if they don't exist then please don't ruin or spam the thread here.

if there was an option in the GUI, I would show you where it was. I did show you how to get the info, it just wasn’t the way you wanted to do it. This is the beauty of open source, you could potentially add that functionality yourself if you have the programming ability (that’s not something in my skill set personally), or you could make a feature request to the maintainers of the code to see if they could Implement something. It doesn’t hurt to ask.

what I find most interesting here is that you immediately noticed this lack of functionality and called it out as being backwards and technically lacking, but yet I have used Linux for over 20 years and never even noticed this. It’s simply not something I have ever had a need for, and like I said, I’m never in the GUI.

exploder said:

To succeed with Linux you have to loose the Windows mindset, they are completely different. The same would be true for someone trying Windows after only running Linux.

I completely disagree.

For Linux to succeed -- it must embrace the common operating system mindset and then try to make itself better than Mac and Windows.

I used Mac OS exclusively for 29 years, Windows for about 5 years now. So when I say 'common' I'm not referring to Windows. I'm referring to expectations of a typical OS.

It is typical and appropriate to expect an OS to provide some sort of area at the top of any window to minimize, maximize, or close a window. It is inappropriate to insist it be in the upper right hand corner because Windows. This is why many distros allow you to EASILY move those buttons to either corner. A plus for Linux.

It is atypical to not provide the creation date of a file in said files properties. Mac and Windows do it. There's no smart reason or advantage Linux doesn't. That's just sloppy (and I as stated in a different post) rather surprising.

Last summer-ish I made my final ditch attempt at embracing Linux after years of dabbling. I had a 1Ghz Celeron Mini PC that was understandably sluggish with Windows 10 and I figured, WTH, let's see if I can make it an awesome Linux box. I tried Ubuntu Mate and Zorin Core. The good news was that Mini began to fly under Linux. Easily twice as fast.

The bad news is best summed up with two main comments --

1. Software installs on Linux are a fiasco. There are four different ways to do this: terminal, package manager, snap stores, and downloading direct. Pick any method and if something goes wrong (which isn't rare) a Linux type will say "there was a better way to do that". There are various ways to install apps/programs on Macs and PCs. They all work flawlessly.

2. Linux isn't stable. I tried Mate and Zorin 3 times each. The last time on each install I attempted to tweak or terminal nothing. Just tried to use it as is to see if I was breaking the system or the system was going buggy by itself. It was the latter.

As far as Linux not being stable, I could not disagree more. Perhaps for running desktop and desktop style apps. But on the server front, Linux boxes can run for years and years without crashing, rebooting, etc. If you are running things like Apache, mysql, tomcat, nginx, postfix, bind, exim, redis, etc....its a fantastic server os.

My experience with trying to use Ubuntu, SuSE or mint as a desktop replacement has been simply not worth the effort to me. The cost of windows 10 is worth it here for me. The cost of Windows server for apps like those mentioned above, are not worth the costs.