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  1. Joined : Dec 2013
    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 8,196
    Windows 10 IoT
       02 Aug 2015 #51

    John Pombrio said: View Post
    Using Read Write Everything, I no longer have an MSDM table in my UEFI BIOS which is where the old Win8.1 SN was located. I have to assume that ANY Win10 activations that come from a clean install on my computer after doing an upgrade will be coming only from my MS account.
    "I no longer have an MSDM table in my UEFI BIOS " because you erased it? That statement confuses me? You had one but now you don't?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  2. Joined : Dec 2013
    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 8,196
    Windows 10 IoT
       02 Aug 2015 #52

    ant1 said: View Post
    Same here, I don't use a microsoft account. I upgraded then checked it was activated properly, then installed from scratch using the bootable distribution made with windows 10 media creation tool, skipping the enter your license prompts, and my clean install activated itself automatically, no problem.
    Just checked with RWeverything and my original license is still in uefi/bios (under the MSDM tab in ACPI Table).
    Windows doesn't do anything to the BIOS, so if you had an embedded key before, you still have one now. Windows 10 install media likely ignores it unless its a Windows 10 embedded key. New OEM PC's are going to ship with embedded Windows 10 keys now I would think.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  3. Joined : Jul 2015
    Posts : 6,849
    Windows 10 Pro
       02 Aug 2015 #53

    John Pombrio said: View Post
    Say I build a new computer a year and half from now. I have a LOT of Win7 and Win8.1 licenses but in order to get Win10, I would have to load in a copy of the old OS and upgrade to Win10. But Win10 upgrade is no longer around so no free upgrade. Nor could I use a preexisting Win10 copy moved over. So I need to buy a retail version of Win10 Pro. Now I KNOW that I will be building computers in the future so why not just buy the retail Win 10 Pro now? If my computer goes hinky in the meantime, I have a valid way to just load in Win10 from scratch.
    Besides, I have used OEM versions of Windows in the past and they can be a pain. I much rather have a retail version of windows which is a lot more useful.
    I'll tell you why not. You purchase a retail license Windows 10 Pro. That gives you the rights to have it installed on only one computer at a time. You install that licensed copy on your existing (old) computer. When you build the new one, you have to remove the OS from the old computer and MOVE it to the new computer - you can't have it installed on both at the same time.

    or

    You use the free upgrade on your old computer. That gives you a Windows 10 license for the old computer which is valid for the life of that old computer. You can clean install it as many times as you want on the old computer. (Such as hard drive replacement or hard drive upgrade). Now, 1 1/2 years from now you build a new computer and you purchase a Windows 10 retail license for it. Now what do you have? You have your old computer with a still valid license and you have a new computer with a license. All you did by buying your license today is cheated yourself out of the free license you would have gotten from MS. Your initial post is pretty much babble.

    Back in the day, I purchased a special Windows 8 upgrade from the Navy Exchange that was good for three computers - with only one key. I upgraded 3 computers with it and then upgraded those to Windows 10 for free. Now I have three licenses for Windows 10 that are good for as many times as I want to install it for the life of and on those computers.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  4.    02 Aug 2015 #54

    Is this why my friend and me have the same CD-Key when we upgraded?
    Literally, it's the same.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  5. Joined : Jul 2015
    Posts : 50
    Windows 10
       02 Aug 2015 #55

    John Pombrio said: View Post
    The confusion that most people are having is what they are getting with the Win10 upgrade. Too many people are assuming that MS is giving away free copies of retail Windows 10. That is simply not the case. MS is letting Win8.1 users patch their Win8.1 computer to make it run a a copy of Win10 with very limited rights. If you want all the rights that a retail version has, you need to BUY a copy of the full retail Win10 Pro product. Don't confuse the two, they are completely different in what you can do with them. From another of my posts:

    Think of the Win10 upgrade as simply an update patch on top of Windows 8.1 to make it look like Win10. Lets call it Win8.1++. Don't think of it as a completely new install of Win10 because it isn't! It only has a generic product key and it does not have a way of doing a clean install by just using a Win7/Win 8.1 product key on a new computer. You do have the ability to do a clean install of Win10 on the upgraded computer, but only on that upgraded computer. Like any other retail copy of Win8.1 that you want to move to a new computer, you first have to do a clean install of Win8.1 then run updates on it including the one to make it LOOK LIKE Win10 (Win8.1++). Of course, you need to wipe the old copy of Win8.1++ off of the original machine as well. Simple enough. Oh, and you only have a year to play with it before the win10 update patch for Win8.1 that turns it into Win8.1++ goes away so no more transfers to a new computer after that (unless MS once again changes the rules or make exceptions).

    If you want a real, complete retail version of Windows 10 with all its rights and privileges including the ability for a clean install on a new computer, then you have to buy Windows 10 Pro for $199 which will give you a unique, valid Windows 10 product key.
    I'm not sure where to begin in tearing apart this utter drivel.

    Lets start with looks like windows 10...well that would imply that it's still windows 8 or 7....So you think I don't have DX 12 that's cute, I hope you keep thinking that when you realise many features in Windows 10 simply could never work in windows 8 let alone windows 7 as they simply don't have the back end coding to support them.

    The limited rights you refer to are to do with upgrade rights, The windows 10 we install is free to transfer to another PC providing we do it within in the upgrade year and preinstall windows 7-8 then install windows 10 upgrade then clean install windows 10 on top of that making it a clean install on a valid licence key.

    I think it's pretty obvious we will have to buy a new copy of windows 10 outside of that upgrade year if we want to upgrade our PC's. Seems like a really obvious thing to do given the major changes coming to the PC industry over the next few years that will mean everything we think is great now will look like crap in a few years.

    I expect better on this forum.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  6. Joined : Jun 2015
    Posts : 42
    Win10
       02 Aug 2015 #56

    lolcocks said: View Post
    Is this why my friend and me have the same CD-Key when we upgraded?
    Literally, it's the same.
    Yes. You don't get a real key with the upgrade.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  7. Joined : Jul 2015
    Posts : 6,849
    Windows 10 Pro
       02 Aug 2015 #57

    lolcocks said: View Post
    Is this why my friend and me have the same CD-Key when we upgraded?
    Literally, it's the same.
    When Windows 10 is activated for the first time, it creates an anonymous hardware ID (called a hash) that is stored on Microsoft servers. Theoretically, every computer will generate a unique hardware ID which stays the same unless you change a major component such as the motherboard or processor. The first thing a new Windows 10 upgrade or clean install does to activate is create the hardware ID from your computer and see if it exists in Microsoft's database from a previous activation. If it does, it activates - license keys are completely ignored. If that hardware ID does not exist, then it looks for a valid license key. If it finds a valid license key (on your system or that you enter manually), then it enters the hardware ID it created from your computer into the Microsoft database and activates - future activations on that same computer, such as future clean installs, will activate from that Hardware ID that was saved in the Microsoft database.

    That is why most Windows 10 upgrades will have the same license key - it isn't really used for activation - it's just there to fill a legacy spot. The Hardware ID has replaced the license keys for activation. And that is also why Windows 10 will activate even on a computer where the user isn't using a Microsoft user account - it's tied to the computer hardware ID, not an account.

    The only people who will have issues are those that want to move their license from one computer to another because the hardware ID will be different. But Microsoft has made that pretty simple too. You call them, enter in the code that Windows gives you for activation, answer a recorded voice prompt that your windows (or office) license is installed on only computer, and it activates with the new hardware ID generated from the new computer.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  8.    02 Aug 2015 #58

    NavyLCDR said: View Post
    When Windows 10 is activated for the first time, it creates an anonymous hardware ID (called a hash) that is stored on Microsoft servers. Theoretically, every computer will generate a unique hardware ID which stays the same unless you change a major component such as the motherboard or processor. The first thing a new Windows 10 upgrade or clean install does to activate is create the hardware ID from your computer and see if it exists in Microsoft's database from a previous activation. If it does, it activates - license keys are completely ignored. If that hardware ID does not exist, then it looks for a valid license key. If it finds a valid license key (on your system or that you enter manually), then it enters the hardware ID it created from your computer into the Microsoft database and activates - future activations on that same computer, such as future clean installs, will activate from that Hardware ID that was saved in the Microsoft database.

    That is why most Windows 10 upgrades will have the same license key - it isn't really used for activation - it's just there to fill a legacy spot. The Hardware ID has replaced the license keys for activation. And that is also why Windows 10 will activate even on a computer where the user isn't using a Microsoft user account - it's tied to the computer hardware ID, not an account.

    The only people who will have issues are those that want to move their license from one computer to another because the hardware ID will be different. But Microsoft has made that pretty simple too. You call them, enter in the code that Windows gives you for activation, answer a recorded voice prompt that your windows (or office) license is installed on only computer, and it activates with the new hardware ID generated from the new computer.
    Wow, thanks for all that information.
    +rep.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  9. Joined : Aug 2015
    Posts : 2
    Windows 10
       02 Aug 2015 #59

    teachermark said: View Post
    Delete every post on this thread except jimbo45s and it will make sense.
    I agree. Haven't read the whole thread, but I'm hoping most of it involves shaming the OP for attempting to spread egregious misinformation.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  10.    02 Aug 2015 #60

    StephenP said: View Post
    I agree. Haven't read the whole thread, but I'm hoping most of it involves shaming the OP for attempting to spread egregious misinformation.
    Agreed
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


 
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