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  1.    01 Aug 2015 #31
    Join Date : Dec 2013
    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 10,612
    Windows 10 IoT
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by Kari View Post
    I give up.

    Everything points to MS being quite generous with Insiders, almost every install and upgrade path seems to work and activate. For me it looks quite clear, and my own tests support this, that when you sign in to Insider page using a pre 29th of July created Insider account, and then from that page being signed in with the said Insider account launch the Media Creation tool to create valid install media, pretty much all installations done with that media using said MS / Insider account will be activated and are 100% valid and legal, regardless if clean or upgrade install.

    Please do not tell me that if I use my own, registered MS / Insider account to legally obtain an official and valid Windows 10 install media and that Windows 10 when installed is then automatically and permanently activated, it is not a valid and legal copy of Windows.
    I'm just trying nail down all the facts, and get it straight in my mind is all. If it was that simple why did Microsoft even bother with the free upgrade offer? I don't have to sign in to download from the Media Creation Tool? Not on its page, and I go directly there? If you had done a clean install on that second PC, with no sysprep etc. I doubt it would have activated. If it did that would mean free windows 10 for anybody on any PC. All my PC's are already upgraded and registered so I can't test that out. one post above seems to back it up though. A motherboard swap and activation failed.
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  2.    01 Aug 2015 #32
    Join Date : Dec 2013
    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 10,612
    Windows 10 IoT
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyhi View Post
    If you had an Insider preview on that PC already - you can leave insider and keep the Pro edition..

    You must upgrade a qualifying OS to get activation..

    You should then be able to transfer a Retail Upgrade activation to another PC via Phone Activation
    Ah but how do you do that if they all use generic keys? In the past you would install on the new PC with your unique product key. Then do the phone activation. Now if you install with the generic key, how does Microsoft ID the other install your transferring, it could be any PC on the planet with that code?
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  3.    01 Aug 2015 #33
    Join Date : Dec 2013
    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 10,612
    Windows 10 IoT
    Thread Starter

    Kari, one more question? Of these 3 or so PC's you reported as activated with windows 10, how many of them were done by conventional installs? A clean install, or an upgrade install, no sysprep or imaging etc? And before that, was the windows 10 insider preview ever installed and activated on them?
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  4.    01 Aug 2015 #34
    Join Date : Oct 2013
    Texas
    Posts : 11,024
    Windows 10 Pro X64

    MS has stated, If you upgrade from a retail version, it carries the rights of a retail version. You can transfer it.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  5.    01 Aug 2015 #35
    Join Date : Oct 2013
    A Finnish expat in Germany
    Posts : 13,122
    Windows 10 Pro

    More like a short story than a post but here's my tests detailed:

    All in all I have described a series of tests with five machines, three of them physical machines (laptops) and two Hyper-V virtual machines. Let's call them PC1, PC2, PC3, VM1 and VM2.

    To start with the PC1 had UK English Windows 8.1 Pro Retail, the operating systems in PC2 and PC3 are irrelevant because before starting I wiped both empty.

    Using another computer, not included in these tests in any way I signed in to Insider site and created the UK-EN x64 USB install media using the MS tool the Insider site provides. Using this install media I started the in-place upgrade on PC1.

    I do most things around Windows by the book. Microsoft has made the OS transfer process quite clear and I do it as they recommend, not using any third party tools (quote from https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/...h825033.aspx):

    Important

    You must use the Sysprep /generalize command to generalize a complete Windows installation before you can use the installation for deployment to a new computer, whether you use imaging, hard disk duplication, or another method. Moving or copying a Windows image to a different computer without running the Sysprep /generalize command is not supported.
    Hence, when the in-place upgrade was done and my main purpose was to test the transfer process to completely different hardware I generalized the newly upgraded Windows 10 Pro with Sysprep. About generalizing:

    Note   Note
    What does Sysprep generalizing do to my Windows setup?

    • All system specific information is removed or uninstalled
    • Security ID (SID) of your hardware setup is reseted
    • All system restore points are deleted
    • All event logs are deleted
    • All personalization is removed (taskbar, toolbars, folder options, start orb etc.) if the CopyProfile component is not set TRUE in answer file
    • Built-in administrator account will be disabled if it was enabled


    Using the SHUTDOWN switch with Sysprep command Windows was automatically shutdown after the generalizing process was done. I now booted the PC1 with Macrium boot disk and captured the image, created a system image.

    I booted PC2 now with Macrium boot disk and restored the generalized image from PC1, containing as told earlier a Windows 10 Pro upgraded from 8.1 Pro Retail. When a generalized Windows is booted, on the machine where the generalization was done or as in this case on another machine, this happens:

    Note   Note
    What happens when booting first time after sysprep generalizing?

    • First boot configuration is run (OOBE)
    • New SID is created
    • Re-arm counter is reseted if not already re-armed three times
    • Windows is booted using first boot default drivers and settings



    Windows on PC2 was automatically activated after the OOBE phase, when finally on desktop. At this point I decided to use the MS Media Creation tool again to make a "universal" install media, containing both 32 and 64 bit versions of UK-EN Windows 10 Pro. When the media was created, I wiped the PC1 hard disks empty and booted it with this new install media, installing Windows 10 using my MS / Insider account. Windows was activated.

    Now I decided to test the Media Creation tool to create a third install media, this time an ISO image with both 32 and 64 bit versions of Windows 10 Pro. Created VM1, a new Hyper-V virtual machine and using this ISO installed Windows 10 Pro using my MS / Insider account. Windows was activated. Repeated the above told process, generalizing VM1 and capturing it as an image and restored said image to PC3 with Macrium. Windows on PC3 was activated.

    Used Microsoft's (Sysinternal) Disk2VHD tool and created a virtual hard disk of the Windows setup on PC3. Created VM2 selecting "Use an existing VHD" option, used the VHD created from PC3 setup. Windows on VM2 was activated.

    The five machines involved in this test, clean installs at the moment on PC1 and VM1. An upgrade install on PC2, a deployed activated image on PC3 and VM2.
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  6.    01 Aug 2015 #36
    Join Date : Dec 2013
    Sydney, Nova Scotia, Canada
    Posts : 10,612
    Windows 10 IoT
    Thread Starter

    Quote Originally Posted by Dude View Post
    MS has stated, If you upgrade from a retail version, it carries the rights of a retail version. You can transfer it.
    Why say, "Free for the life of the device" then? Why not just say free forever. Transferring a purchased retail copy would be pretty straight forward, you have a unique key to move to a new PC. Not so easy with the free upgrade though, I'm thinking. I almost regret starting this thread. I hesitated for a long time before posting it.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  7.    01 Aug 2015 #37
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Posts : 1,395
    Windows 10 Pro (32-bit) 16299.15

    Quote Originally Posted by Kari View Post
    To start with the PC1 had UK English Windows 8.1 Pro Retail, the operating systems in PC2 and PC3 are irrelevant because before starting I wiped both empty.
    But had PC2 or PC3 had an Insider build activated before on them? If so then the hardware signatures may already be recorded in the Activation Servers, regardless of whether you wiped them.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  8.    01 Aug 2015 #38
    Join Date : Jan 2014
    Posts : 1,395
    Windows 10 Pro (32-bit) 16299.15

    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    Why say, "Free for the life of the device" then?
    It's "free for the supported life of the device". The supported perhaps means you may need the OEM to help out with a product key when you change the motherboard.
      My ComputerSystem Spec
  9.    01 Aug 2015 #39
    Join Date : Oct 2013
    Texas
    Posts : 11,024
    Windows 10 Pro X64

    Quote Originally Posted by alphanumeric View Post
    Why say, "Free for the life of the device" then? Why not just say free forever. Transferring a purchased retail copy would be pretty straight forward, you have a unique key to move to a new PC. Not so easy with the free upgrade though, I'm thinking. I almost regret starting this thread. I hesitated for a long time before posting it.
    Do not regret opening this thread, you have brought up a very good point. MS seems to be stating things that are conflicting. The answer is "clear as mud'.
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  10.    01 Aug 2015 #40
    Join Date : Oct 2013
    A Finnish expat in Germany
    Posts : 13,122
    Windows 10 Pro

    Quote Originally Posted by DavidY View Post
    But had PC2 or PC3 had an Insider build activated before on them? If so then the hardware signatures may already be recorded in the Activation Servers, regardless of whether you wiped them.
    Yes, both had Insider Preview build installed and used on them, at the moment of me wiping them empty one had clean installed 10240, installed two weeks before the launch, and one 10166 upgraded to 10240 also two weeks before the launch.
      My ComputerSystem Spec

 
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