Am I "saddled" with a "slowly croaking" motherboard??

DaveC · 01 Apr 2021

Dear TenForums:

DaveC here again - as my 2015-vintage Biostar A85S3 motherboard is going past its fifth birthday, I've now lost the access to the Seagate 500 GB hard disk where all my data resides, which was last backed up way back at the end of August 2020.

The current manifest of "what's in the machine" for its hardware reads as follows:

Biostar A85S3 v.6.1 Hi-Fi motherboard
AMD A8-6600K CPU
Adaptec 29320LPE SCSI card (to be removed)
16 GB of Crucial RAM memory
Nvidia Quadro K620 2 GB video memory, workstation video card
Samsung 860 EVO 1 TB SATA-3 SSD drive (C: volume for Windows 10 X64, D: volume for all applications)
Seagate 500 GB SATA-3 hard drive (disconnected, due to possible failure)
Enermax 530W Revolution modular-DC-cable power supply

A fast-arriving set of new upgrade parts has been coming together over the past month or two, for what I fear COULD be a needed upgrade, since I HAD to install the "dreaded Win-10 v.20H2 update" about 2-3 weeks ago:

Biostar B550GTA "Racing" AM4-socket mobo, for AMD Ryzen CPUs
AMD Ryzen 7 3700X eight-core CPU (3.6 GHz clock, 65W normal current drain)
Deepcool "Gammaxx-300" triple-copper heatpipe CPU cooler (vertical radiator, w/120 mm-class fan unit)
Crucial 2.66 GHz, 16 GBx2 (32 GB) main RAM mobo memory
Nvidia Quadro P1000 4 GB video memory, workstation video card (only item yet to arrive, due in 2-3 weeks)
Enermax 850W output Revolution-DF modular-DC-cable power supply

...and since I've NEVER had the sort of reliability/longevity problems with hard drives for data storage before, that I've had with the SATA hard drives that have been mounted in the "slide-in" PLASTIC hard-drive trays in my current NZXT H230 case - when I had hard drives that mounted in METAL racks fastened in with actual metal machine screws - I'm seriously wondering if a "groundstrap" might be needed to introduce some sort of "true grounding" to my sole hard drive, used only for data storage, as it would have had in cases that HAD metal hard drive bays that metal machine screws provided some degree of "true grounding" for any hard drives, at the very least.

Also, since I've been using the Win10 X64 install WITH v.20H2 in place for a fortnight now (as OS Build 19042.867), I've also noticed that it "just appears" to be "pushing my PC harder"...I'm getting Microsoft's own brand of "advanced BSOD" with the frown emoji-on-its-side (the ": (" variety) as well as my overheating/"spontaneous-reboot" problem, previously discussed here at TenForums, that I'd THOUGHT that the quartet of 120mm class high-airflow fans would cure - but v.20H2 "just seems" to be pushing my five-year-old moboed PC "hard enough", that the above mentioned upgrade set-of-hardware MAY have to go in a lot sooner than I thought.

Since my late mother's home IS about to go back on the market, with me still living here (and almost everything moved out that I'm taking with me) and currently "sheltering from the pandemic", I've also been considering a purchase of an AMD Ryzen-based laptop from the local Best Buy, as I've never had a laptop of my own before - I'm planning on a $650 USD top price that I'd prefer not to exceed, as it could easily substitute for my desktop PC until the move has happened.

So...as I'm going to try to mount the "sick Seagate" 500 GB SATA drive in a metal-case Dell 9100 Dimension PC that STILL should be working, to try and get the "sick Seagate" working just long enough (it only has a bit under 50 GB of data on it!) to archive the entire drive on a second Kingston 128 GB capacity SATA-3 thumb drive (the other has the August 30, 2020-dated backup in place already of all my data on IT). I'm seriously wondering...

1-where is a decent place to get a RELIABLE hard disk drive for data storage, that isn't going to croak like Western Digital-brand HDs do...and "please don't say Newegg"...

2-is a "grounding strap" inside the metal PC case a good recommendation, for a slide-in, plastic-tray-mounted hard drive...

3-given that the house I'm living in IS on the market over the coming few months, would it just be best to store away the upgrade parts and my ailing desltop PC's console for the upcoming move, and just use any new AMD-chipped laptop I'd be getting with my monitor (Iiyama ProLite XB2485 widescreen CAD-optimized monitor), Das Keyboard 104-key regular-size PC keyboard, and Kensington Expert Mouse trackball?

Thanks in advance for any useful answers...I do expect to "go for the AMD laptop" before too much longer, though, as in "before April's over".

Yours Sincerely,
DaveC

dalchina · 02 Apr 2021

a RELIABLE hard disk drive for data storage, that isn't going to croak like Western Digital-brand HDs do...and "please don't say Newegg"...

Hi, in a recent post I cited data showing Western Digital drives with a failure rate some 3-4 times higher than Hitachi (HGST) or Toshiba.

You might like to try one of those instead.

Disk Monitoring
Free: Crystal Diskinfo can be set to report incipient failure (degraded SMART params) against thresholds, continuously monitoring your disks.

Hopefully you are using disk imaging regularly and routinely as is so very often recommended here. The act of creating an image verifies the integrity of the used part of the partitions imaged.

Controlling upgrades

since I HAD to install the "dreaded Win-10 v.20H2 update" about 2-3 weeks ago:

- There are easy ways not to have to upgrade if you so wish. For example, I'm staying with 1903 for a couple of reasons, having initially been deterred by MS's debacle messing up Windows search so badly in the early releases of 1909.

You have Pro, so if you set updates to Notify in group policy, updates will only be downloaded and applied when you allow them to be.

There are 3rd party solutions to taking complete control of Windows Update from that in a tutorial as option 7 on disabling WU, to others mentioned time and again here over the years.

Ghot · 02 Apr 2021

@DaveC

1. HDDs do better in the plastic slide in trays, and they don't need metal tray ground. Ground comes from the connector.

2. Try to get away from Biostar motherboards.. Stick with ASUS, MSI, Gigabyte.

3. AMD A8 or A6 CPUs (APUs) aren't all that. The AMD 3700X is a good CPU, so you're OK with that.

RolandJS · 02 Apr 2021

I hope you can rescue the data from that HDD you mentioned in the opening! Saving data is first, saving hardware is second. After this situation is resolved, going forward, please make full images of OS partitions and data partitions onto external media at least bi-monthly if not weekly, along with making a DVD and a USB boot stick for Restore purposes.

ignatzatsonic · 02 Apr 2021

see comments

DaveC said:

1-where is a decent place to get a RELIABLE hard disk drive for data storage, that isn't going to croak like Western Digital-brand HDs do...and "please don't say Newegg"...

Standard second source would be Amazon.

HD brands is largely a coin toss. There are plenty of bad examples from all of them. No reason not to switch if you'd be nervous about staying with the same brand, but realize the element of chance.

2-is a "grounding strap" inside the metal PC case a good recommendation, for a slide-in, plastic-tray-mounted hard drive...

How sure are you that the hard drive is in fact defective?

I can't recall reading anything about using grounding straps on a hard drive.

3-given that the house I'm living in IS on the market over the coming few months, would it just be best to store away the upgrade parts and my ailing desltop PC's console for the upcoming move, and just use any new AMD-chipped laptop I'd be getting with my monitor (Iiyama ProLite XB2485 widescreen CAD-optimized monitor), Das Keyboard 104-key regular-size PC keyboard, and Kensington Expert Mouse trackball?

First goal would be to (one way or another) copy any personal data from the possibly failing hard drive to some other drive. Maybe it isn't failing, but I guess you don't know that yet.

Not sure I understand why you couldn't do the upgrade right now if you had a notion. Not sure why the sale of a house 3 months from now would be a factor. On the other hand, if you are going to get the new laptop regardless, I guess there's no reason you can't use in the meantime. The larger point is to safeguard the data on the possibly failing drive.

There is some risk in "storing" new parts. If they are defective, you wouldn't know they are defective until assembled and your return privileges may have gone by that time. You may have only a 30 day return privilege with the seller?

DaveC · 05 Apr 2021

Dear TenForums:

DaveC here again - the now-"ancient" Dell Dimension 9200 tower PC that my late CAD mentor, Howie Cohen gave me in 2015 (he passed in Nov. 2017) for a spare PC if it was ever needed; was the "article of my sick Seagate's data rescue" on Easter Sunday this year, as that old Dell mid-tower PC used to reside at Boston University, where Howie worked in his "concluding" years. It has a copy of Windows 7 on it and possesses VERY robust SATA drive circuits on it (a total of six), so the "sick Seagate" went into the Dell this past Sunday morning, with my spare Kingston 128 GB SATA-3 spare thumbdrive as the volume to save it ONTO for the needed "data recovery" session...

...so, for RolandJS's concerns (and yours truly's as well) the data FROM the "sick Seagate" is now fully archived on that Kingston 128 GB thumbdrive, with the "sick Seagate" intended to remain in the Dell for the present. (The Windows 7 OS on the Dell even did a CHKDSK run on the "sick Seagate", a likely-needed automated procedure, so now I DEFINITELY know that the old Biostar A85S3 mobo will be removed before April 2021 is over.)

dalchina also recommended a Toshiba HD to replace the "sick Seagate", and thanks to ignatzatsonic's suggestion, THIS link is most likely what I'll be ordering a Toshiba 1 TB 3.5" HD from...likely, to be ordered as early as today (Mon. April 5th).

For Ghot's concerns when he replied with this line...

"2. Try to get away from Biostar motherboards.. Stick with ASUS, MSI, Gigabyte."...

...I'd like to hear back from him, or from anyone he knows, as to HOW much more robust the SATA drive circuits might be on an Asus, Gigabyte or MSI-branded mobo; in comparison to those on a Biostar-branded one - as THAT is now a critical factor for me to consider going forward, in regards to the choice of motherboard. I'll use the Biostar B550GTA for the present, but ANY hint of "SATA circuit wonkiness" from the B550GTA, WILL be met with swift consideration - when my funds permit it - of a roughly-equivalent AMD Ryzen-compatible mobo, from any of the trio of brand names mentioned in his response.

The existing Nvidia Quadro K620 video card is likely to be goin' into the upgraded PC, as the replacement Quadro P1000's "drop-ship date" could still be a good two weeks further on in time. The upgrade's Enermax 850 watt upgrade power supply I've got on hand for the upgrade is a drop-in replacement for the 530-watt version, and would likely power it for the foreseeable future, as my desktop PCs have always been powered - since 1992 - through a Tripp Lite AC power-line conditioner.

If this coming weekend's not terribly busy, I could manage to get the B550GTA installed with the new Enermax 850W power supply in the NZXT H230 case I've been using since 2015 - the Quadro K620 video card will continue in use until the Quadro P1000 gets to me, with the Toshiba 1 TB SATA-3 3.5" internal hard disk I'm likely to order later today, likely to get installed after the B550GTA mobo/Enermax 850W PS components are all in and functioning properly.

Got to get the new Toshiba 1 TB HD ordered...I'll let everyone know how well the "initial installation" goes over this coming weekend.

Thanks for everything so far and Yours Sincerely,
DaveC

dalchina · 05 Apr 2021

Thanks for the update. Note 2 things:

a. Plan your backups from the start. Strongly recommended - routine disk imaging at least of all your O/S partitions. E.g. Macrium Reflect (free) + large enough external storage. I.e. you may wish to consider ordering an external disk as well, or use one you've already got.

Start a sequence of imaging and do that periodically as you install and configure. Don't hope to get everyhting set up and have it break before creating your first image.

b. Plan to keep as much of your personal data off C: so it's not affected by O/S maintenance from restoring an image to a clean install. E.g. create another partition or use a 2nd disk if your PC can take one.

Plan your backup strategy from the start.

Ghot · 05 Apr 2021

DaveC said:

For Ghot's concerns when he replied with this line...

"2. Try to get away from Biostar motherboards.. Stick with ASUS, MSI, Gigabyte."...

...I'd like to hear back from him, or from anyone he knows, as to HOW much more robust the SATA drive circuits might be on an Asus, Gigabyte or MSI-branded mobo; in comparison to those on a Biostar-branded one - as THAT is now a critical factor for me to consider going forward, in regards to the choice of motherboard. I'll use the Biostar B550GTA for the present, but ANY hint of "SATA circuit wonkiness" from the B550GTA, WILL be met with swift consideration - when my funds permit it - of a roughly-equivalent AMD Ryzen-compatible mobo, from any of the trio of brand names mentioned in his response.

There's no way I know of, to attach a value to the wonkiness of motherboards or their SATA controllers.

I CAN tell you that I have been running "middle of the pack" ASUS boards for almost 20 years now. Never had a SATA issue, of any kind.

By the same token, I've been building and fixing desktop computers for almost 20 years, and haven't really seen any motherboard issues with "middle of the pack" MSI or Gigabyte motherboards, either.

It's always been a rule of thumb for me to stick to computer hardware of just about any kind, that's about halfway up the price list or better, from any company.
For motherboards in particular, aim for ones that are 6 layers or greater, as well.

DaveC · 05 Apr 2021

Dear dalchina:

DaveC here again - I was first informed about Macrium's backup solutions a number of months ago, so, to go along with their "free" edition, would a decent-capacity external drive, like a Crucial-brand SSD-based external drive of some 1 TB capacity, be a decent place to "start" for OS backups?

I was advised to go with Crucial while I've had the Biostar A85S3 mobo in my PC for its 16 GB of RAM, and I've also got one of their 32 GB thumbdrives on my keychain, which has proved reliably useful many times since I obtained it directly from them - hence my purchase of 32 GB of Crucial RAM for my new B550GTA mobo upgrade.

The exact model I was lookin' at, at Amazon, is THIS one; which isn't going for too much for funds (about US $150 before postage), and with the moveout this Spring (and my moving costs in mind), this would most likely be a May 2021-timeframe purchase.

At this time, the Samsung 860 SSD 1 TB drive that's split between my C: drive volume - for my Win10 install only occupies some 41 GB for its OS installation; out of 340 GB in total (just about 300 GB free), and my D: applications-only drive on hte Samsung has a paltry 3 GB occupied, out of a total of 300 GB...and not a single "detailed" piece (text files, etc.) about yours truly on that entire volume.

So...does the Crucial SSD-based "external backup drive" solution seem like it's something along the lines of what you were thinking of?

Thanks in advance and Yours Sincerely,
DaveC

dalchina · 06 Apr 2021

Hi, some say external SSDs are more reliable (e.g. if dropped), but of course are around 3-5 times as much as a HDD (which I use).

As to dimensioning your backup storage:
a. Your base image will be largest
b. MR free only allows differentials (to restore you need the base image, or that + any differential). Differential images represent the difference between base and 'now' thus are larger than incrementals but normally smaller than the base.
(Licensed offers incrementals and more features + write access to MR's forums).
c. Simply considering your (4 for UEFI) O/S partitions- allow, say, for 1xbase + 4 differentials.
When you create your backup job when creating your base image, this can readily be set up to limit the number of image files retained, effectively setting an approx max limit on storage.

You can image any disk or partition.

Creating a differential image for my OS and lots of progs from a SSD to a HDD over USB3 (make sure your external drive is USB3 or better) takes perhaps 12-13 mins.

Of course, were you to get, say, 3x HDD rather than 1xSSD for the price, you could have multiple backups- say 1 manual, stored physically separately, and 1 on-line and scheduled.....

Useful trick - It's valuable to have the backup drive assigned the same drive letter each time so that matches what the backup job expects. This can be done in 2 ways.
a. MR support drive recognition by hardware id. (I've not used it, only know of it).
b. Assign a late drive letter- say R for Reflect- to one drive only using Disk Management. Thus that drive is assigned R next time.

Am I "saddled" with a "slowly croaking" motherboard??

Am I "saddled" with a "slowly croaking" motherboard??

The Easter weekend proved MOST appropriate...for data recovery!

Would an external SSD drive be a decent "starting place"?