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  1. Joined : Oct 2013
    A Finnish ex-pat in Germany
    Posts : 9,081
    Windows 10 Pro
       04 Oct 2016 #11

    OK, I decided not to wait next Insider build upgrade to get screenshots and this thing cleared. What I did instead was the fastest way I could think of getting the screenshots: I installed an older Windows 10 PRO Insider Preview (I used build 14926) on a test machine, opted in to Fast Ring upgrades, and waited until Windows Update found the upgrade.

    When upgrade files had been downloaded and prepared for the upgrade process, the Restart now button was shown in Settings. Using Restart options I could have postponed an automatic restart almost a week (system allows you to postpone it to the end of the sixth day after upgrade has been downloaded and prepared):

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    Regardless if I use Restart options or not, now I have the option to select either Update and Shut down / Restart, or Shut down / Restart without update (upgrade), whatever method I use to show shut down options.

    In three first screenshots below #1 = Windows version and edition, #2 = showing that a new Insider build has been downloaded and prepared, #3 = shut down options. As #1 & #2 can't be shown in sign-in screen, the fourth screenshot from the same machine only shows shut down options.

    Start:

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    Right click Start:

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    ALT + F4:

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    Sign-in screen:

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    The option to shut down or restart without update / upgrade will not be there forever; depending on which non-critical update or upgrade gives you this option it might be there only a day or two, or as in case of build upgrade, the option to postpone it and shut down or restart without upgrading is available the same amount of time that is the max time you can select in restart options, to the end of the sixth day after upgrade has been downloaded and prepared.

    I used build upgrade now to get the screenshots but it is by far not the only update / upgrade offering these options. Just remember, all critical updates need to be installed immediately, therefore option to shut down or restart without update is not always shown.

    When Windows decides it's no longer possible to postpone the update / upgrade, option to shut down or restart without updating / upgrading is no longer shown

    Kari
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  2. Joined : Apr 2015
    Posts : 9,115
    W10Prox64
       05 Oct 2016 #12

    Thanks for that Kari. I've used the custom restart time in the past when it's been available. I just don't recall having the option to shutdown without installing - even when I set the custom install date for several days out. Wonder why...
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  3. Joined : Oct 2013
    A Finnish ex-pat in Germany
    Posts : 9,081
    Windows 10 Pro
       05 Oct 2016 #13

    simrick said: View Post
    Thanks for that Kari. I've used the custom restart time in the past when it's been available. I just don't recall having the option to shutdown without installing - even when I set the custom install date for several days out. Wonder why...
    I wanted to show with these screenshots that what I said earlier really is valid information. I said this yesterday, quite arrogantly (yes, I admit that):

    Kari said: View Post
    I'll get a screenshot when the next Insider build comes, probably later this week. I can promise to get the screenshot because I know those options will be there when it's time to upgrade.

    However, the arrogance had a reason: I knew that I just have to wait for an upgrade if no other update would offer those options before that, latest then could I for 100% sure get the screenshots. The option to shutdown or restart without updating is always there after a build upgrade, and after certain non-critical updates.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  4. Joined : Apr 2015
    Posts : 9,115
    W10Prox64
       05 Oct 2016 #14

    Could it be that I don't see them because I am not on Insider builds?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  5. Joined : Oct 2013
    A Finnish ex-pat in Germany
    Posts : 9,081
    Windows 10 Pro
       05 Oct 2016 #15

    I don't think so. As I mentioned, Insider build upgrades are not only update types that offer those options. I do not believe Windows Update would work differently on public release builds and Insider builds.

    One thing is clear: if a user always when WU shows Restart now button clicks it, this user would naturally never see the option to restart or shut down without updating.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  6. Joined : Apr 2015
    Posts : 9,115
    W10Prox64
       06 Oct 2016 #16

    @Kari
    Working on someone's laptop just now, running MBAM scan, found 2 PUPs which I need to reboot in order to clear out. While scanning, KB3914496 downloaded again (had failed earlier), and is requiring a reboot to install. Now, I need to finish what I'm doing with MBAM first, and I wanted you to see this:



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    I changed the active hours, as it was ready to shutdown on me as the MBAM scan finished.

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    I delayed the restart until October 12th - no difference.

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    So I am not crazy, and it is a problem. :-(
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  7. Joined : Apr 2015
    Posts : 9,115
    W10Prox64
       06 Oct 2016 #17

    One more:
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails shutdown09.PNG  
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  8. Joined : Oct 2013
    A Finnish ex-pat in Germany
    Posts : 9,081
    Windows 10 Pro
       07 Oct 2016 #18

    simrick said: View Post
    Kari
    Working on someone's laptop just now, running MBAM scan, found 2 PUPs which I need to reboot in order to clear out. While scanning, KB3914496 downloaded again (had failed earlier), and is requiring a reboot to install. Now, I need to finish what I'm doing with MBAM first, and I wanted you to see this:
    And your point is what?

    Extract from an earlier post of mine:

    Kari said: View Post
    I used build upgrade now to get the screenshots but it is by far not the only update / upgrade offering these options. Just remember, all critical updates need to be installed immediately, therefore option to shut down or restart without update is not always shown.
    The fact that WU lets you select a later time for automatic restart can seem a bit misleading, but it's there for a logical purpose: it's there for you to select a convenient point of time when the pending updates will be installed in case this PC is one that's always on. I use this feature on an HTPC and a server which are always on (occasionally sleeping / suspended but not shut down / restarted) to make sure they will not restart at for me inconvenient time.

    Cumulative updates always require an immediate restart, immediate in this case not meaning you have to restart the moment update has been downloaded and prepared but instead that pending updates will be installed next time the PC is either shut down or restarted. Update can be postponed only to next shut down / restart, and will be performed latest at the time you select in Restart options if PC has not been shut down / restarted before that.

    If Restart options is not used to select time for an automatic restart and no manual shut down / restart is done, automatic restart will happen soon after next by user selected Active hours time period ends.

    Kari
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  9. Joined : Apr 2015
    Posts : 9,115
    W10Prox64
       07 Oct 2016 #19

    Okay I understand. Thanks. Still is a PITA the way it's set up.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  10. Joined : Oct 2013
    A Finnish ex-pat in Germany
    Posts : 9,081
    Windows 10 Pro
       07 Oct 2016 #20

    simrick said: View Post
    Still is a PITA the way it's set up.
    Yet it's completely logical:


    • Critical updates (cumulative, minor build etc.)
      • Must be installed as soon as possible, can be postponed only until next shut down or restart
      • If no manual shut down or restart will be done, an automatic restart to install pending updates will be done at the end of set Active hours or Restart options, whichever comes last

    • Non-critical updates (major build, other updates not requiring immediate install)
      • Can be postponed max to end of sixth day after downloaded and prepared (depends on update) by selecting restart or shut down without updating
      • When above mentioned time period ends, any restart will do the update and install pending updates or build upgrade, option to shutdown or restart without updating is no longer available
      • If no manual shut down or restart will be done, an automatic restart to install pending updates will be done at the end of set Active hours or Restart options, whichever comes last


    I am using terms major and minor build above as in XXXXX.YYYY where XXXXX is major build and YYYY is minor build. For example I am currently running 14936.1000, 14936 being major and 1000 minor build.

    Kari
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


 
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