Piecing together the Windows as a Service puzzle for Windows 10

WhiteWolf said:

Just a thought
Is there a way to block MS updates using the MS firewall or a third party one, but still be able to use the internet and unblock it when you decide to install any updates.
Not the perfect fix, but at least gives you time to make sure the updates do not muck up your OS and gives you a little control back.

WhiteWolf
You might be able to with the windows host file. I think Brink might come up with registry fix that could delay the updates. One way to delay some is turn on the metered connection, then it won't download some updates if what I read is correct.

Just for info Google Chrome isn't auto updated on my windows 7 computer. To update it, I have to open about Google Chrome.

groze said:

Just for info Google Chrome isn't auto updated on my windows 7 computer. To update it, I have to open about Google Chrome.

Yes, but when you open About, it updates automatically.. you can't stop it.

alphanumeric said:

Not really a valid comparison in my books. A browser versus an entire OS? If Chrome crashes its no big deal, just use another web browser. If my OS blue screens on the first reboot after an update that's a totally different scenario don't you think? Sure you can reimage back, but its just going to do it again as soon as you connect to the internet and it updates again. Assuming Microsoft hasn't pulled that update. Granted its likely going to be a rare occasion, but it happens. Then what do you do?

That is one possibility. If that happened and someone didn't have a working image to restore they'd be in for a big headache. I'm more concerned with MS adding things or making changes that I don't want or need.

It's a good model - does it work - yes, most of the time.

It is rare when MS botches an update and most people look then update everything anyway.

There are a few cases where this is not a good model.

• I agree with the member (sorry, not scrolling back to credit you ... you know who you are ) who said Driver updates should NOT be automatic.
  
  Device Driver Settings in Control Panel\All Control Panel Items\Devices and Printers
  (right click the computer icon) determines if drivers are accepted from WU, we'll see if that sticks around.
  Maybe MS needs to implement a DU (drivers update) - with an option to install or skip.
  
  
• MS one-off technology (Silverlight & Bing come to mind) should NOT be automatic, they should be offered as optional. HTML5 is more widely accepted than Silverlight. Your Search engine is a preference.
  
  
• Botched updates ... these really are rare but might increase with more frequent updates. This is why CBB allows delays. Corporations CANNOT have even a few minutes downtime because MS botched an update.

There are probably more, but ....

I think MS's hand will be forced to change back to the previous model where end users can hide (delay) an update.

We shall see.

Slartybart said:

It is rare when MS botches an update and most people look then update everything anyway.

It's become more common of late... And part of that is caused by the very mechanism itself. By allowing users to cherry pick which updates to apply, it increases the complexity of testing updates astronomically. This becomes untenable a hundreds if not thousands of patches are applied.

One nice thing about the "version release" is that you have a known baseline for testing. You "reset" those combinations and know for a fact that all users running Windows 10 or whatever will have a certain set of issues fixed. But since there won't be any new "baseline" releases anymore, even that won't help.

If you have an "all or nothing" approach to patches, then you know everyone is running on current or near current versions.

Microsoft is in a tough spot. On the one hand, users want the freedom to install what patches they want, and on the other they throw a fit if a patch breaks something. This is known as "having your cake and eating it too". If you want the choice of patches, you have to put up with more risk of broken patches. But, people want choice because they fear broken patches.. so it's a self-perpetuating cycle.

Microsoft will be offering businesses a great deal of flexibility in their update releases. There will be several servicing branches, from "only security patches" to "Update everything all the time, including new features". They will also allow businesses to choose which machines get updates, which machines don't, which machines get updated at which time.. For instance, they will offer the ability to say "Never update within 5 days of the end of the quarter" or "Never update during working hours". They will have the option to not allow updates at all, but I don't think there will be an option to selectively chose them. It will be all or nothing.

Will this cause problems? Probably. But only until everyone gets with the program. You can't keep running decades old broken code that only works when you don't apply specific updates. You either fix the code, or get new applications. It may cause some pain, and those people may be angry. But in the long run, it makes the OS better, software better, security better, etc.. If you don't like it, you're free to use something else, or keep using an older version of Windows for as long as you can keep getting licenses and/or apps continue to run on it.

Consumers will have less choice than businesses, but in general most consumers won't know or care. It's like UAC or the Start Menu... most people will just get used to it, and before long they won't even remember what it was like before or will realize that this is a better way.

I do, however, agree about drivers to some extent. Most drivers are fine to update. However, sometimes users want specific drivers (gamers, for instance, want to run a specific video card driver that's optimized for a specific game), but I think drivers need a different way of updating.

Silverlight is basically dead... so there's not much worry about that anymore. Bing can be turned off. However, it's unlikely that cortana will work with anything other than bing for quite some time as Cortana needs specific bing functionality for a lot of what it does. Microsoft is developing API's for integration into Cortana, and there may be Google and other Cortana plug-ins.. but I am guessing it will be a while.

Botched updates will not be an issue, at least not people who are not on the fast ring. If an update gets promoted out of the fast ring, it will be very well tested. If you're in the fast ring, you might get a botched update.. but that's the risk of living on the bleeding edge.

I was just sitting here thinking about the retail release of Windows 10. This is just my thoughts of what MS is doing. Windows 8 wasn't the success MS wanted it to be. The main reason was they wanted to make a OS the way they wanted and didn't care what the majority wanted. They finally started to listen to the complaints and made a few changes. They still had it in their heads that Windows 8 was going to be the way they wanted it to be. They tried to make just enough changes to make users happy. It still wasn't what the majority wanted. If Windows 8.1 update was the first retail release Windows 8 would have been more accepted. Then MS decided let's give up on Windows 8 and start over. Along comes Windows 10. MS decides to let just about anyone test it so they can see if we will accept it or not. From what I read in the forums Windows 10 TP is a much bigger success than Windows 8 ever was. Then MS starts adding new features to see our reaction. For the most part Windows 10 is still a success. Now MS has a large group of testers telling everyone who will listen how great Windows 10 is going to be. Just what MS wanted to hear. Now with the thought that Windows 10 is not going to be a flop like Windows 8 it's back to plan A. Make Windows the way we wanted in the beginning. What better way to get it installed on as many computers as possible then to tell everyone it's going to be a free upgrade with a qualifying OS. If I have to sacrifice a OS I already have I don't consider it free. It's more like the even up trades I use to do when I was a kid. Once the retail version of Windows 10 makes it to the masses MS is going to go back to trying to tell us how our OS is going look and work like they tried with Windows 8. I really do like Windows 10 as it is now. I'm not so sure if I'll be happy with 10 once it goes final. All I want is to have control over what updates or even upgrades gets installed on my computer. I don't mind automatic security updates. It not only helps protect my computer but other computers also. Plus the fact there are users who would never do a security update unless it was automatic. Just to give a example of what MS could do to our computers. MS is out to make money and like any company they should. What if MS decided they could allow ads as a source to make money. I wouldn't be surprised MS could make more profit this way than by selling the license to us. All they would have to do is install a update to allow ads to be delivered to our computers. After all Windows 10 was free so MS should get something from us in return. I would rather pay for a Windows 10 license and have control of what updates get's installed then have MS give me Windows 10 and take away my options to update or not. This is the end of my sky is falling story. Remember this just my thoughts and not fact. :)