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  1. Join Date : Oct 2016
    Posts : 6
    Windows 10
       4 Weeks Ago #1

    Is default cell width for Excel 2013 8.43 or 8.38?


    Hi guys,
    almost a month ago I was working on a file on Excel 2010 (whose cells were 15 x 8,43), when all of a sudden Windows asked me to install the so-called "Windows 10 anniversary" update and, when I went on to open the file, I found out the cell width had gone from 8.43 to 8.38. As a result, only columns A through R would show on one page (before it was columns A through half of U), because each of them had gotten larger: I guess it was because 8.43 = 64 pixels and 8.38 = 72 pixels (so the number of pixels had increased)!

    I thought it was an issue with an "old version" of Excel, so I uninstalled Office 2010 and had Office 2013 installed instead... and just the opposite happened: originally the cells were 15 x 8,38 (by default), but a second "Windows 10 anniversary" update last Friday brough the width back to 8.43. This is a problem, because I'm adding a bunch of pictures to my file in order to make them fit the cells containing them, and this constant width changes jeopardize that.

    I've found out that "When using ClearType with the Windows Anniversary update, Excel column widths can be larger than in earlier versions of Windows. This happens in only some fonts, such as Calibri. It can affect all versions of Office 2016", so I have disabled ClearType and installed the fix (Windows update KB3197954). Now I'm stuck with blurry text all over my screen (no ClearType) and a grid whose cell width is 8,43 (which I assume was the "right" width, because it was the original one, because the "increased cell width" issue occurs when going from 8.43 to 8.38 and not the other way around, and also because the fix left it that like that instead of brining it back to 8.38).

    Now my question is: am I right? Is 8.43 the "right" width or is it gonna change again? And, now that the bug is supposedly fixed, can I enable ClearType again or should I leave it ticked off for the rest of my life, otherwise this painful experience will happen all over again?

    Sorry for the lengthy post, but there just was no way of asking this question using less words. I've also sought assistance on other forums, and almost everyone has been superrude to me, brushing off my problem and/or ignoring me all of a sudden midway through the conversation. So I hope it's gonna be different this time around. Looking forward to reading your replies ASAP.

      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  2. Join Date : Oct 2016
    Posts : 6
    Windows 10
       4 Weeks Ago #2

    Anyone? Anyone at all?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  3. Join Date : Oct 2016
    Posts : 6
    Windows 10
       4 Weeks Ago #3

    Why is everyone getting a reply while I'm being ignored?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  4. Join Date : Aug 2016
    S/E England
    Posts : 807
    10 Home x64 (1607), Pro x86 (1511)
       4 Weeks Ago #4

    Maybe we're in different time zones?

    It may not be the Windows updates that are changing the default cell widths. If you look in 'Settings > Update & security > Windows Update > Advanced settings' is the 'Give me updates for other Microsoft products...' box ticked? These would include updates for Microsoft Office.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  5.    4 Weeks Ago #5

    MS makes changes like this from time to time, especially as they relate to screen layout. DPI is increasing, so the pixels are getting smaller. I foresee only that the ratio will keep changing, but I can't begin to guess specifics. I think it's just incumbent on us to figure out what MS is doing, and to try to adapt as best we can. When it's more serious or threatens the ability of our PCs to handle the software, it's time to speak up and voice concerns and complaints. Except for those of us who, like you (apparently), spend their working lives inside an Excel spreadsheet, this change to cell width is merely interesting and not a big deal one way or the other. I have a feeling that might explain the lack of response, as well as a general reluctance here on the forums to try as little as possible to read Microsoft's collective mind.
    HTH,
    --Ed--
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  6. Join Date : Aug 2016
    S/E England
    Posts : 807
    10 Home x64 (1607), Pro x86 (1511)
       4 Weeks Ago #6

    ...only columns A through R would show on one page (before it was columns A through half of U)
    If it's the page you see on the screen you're talking about, I adjust that by changing the Zoom Level. Select an area the width you want to see then choose 'Fit selection' in the Zoom dialog box (in Excel 2010 click on the percentage displayed next to the zoom slider).
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  7. Join Date : Oct 2016
    Posts : 6
    Windows 10
       4 Weeks Ago #7

    Bree said: View Post
    Maybe we're in different time zones?

    It may not be the Windows updates that are changing the default cell widths. If you look in 'Settings > Update & security > Windows Update > Advanced settings' is the 'Give me updates for other Microsoft products...' box ticked? These would include updates for Microsoft Office.
    OMG, if I tick that off, will it stop bothering me once and for all or would I also miss important non-Excel-related updates in the process? To the other user, I would like to reply that 8.43 has always been the standard width for Excel cells, which is why I felt a sense of relief when it brough that value back (because I was like "ok, this has all gone back to normal and maybe it won't bug me again!"). Besides, they admitted it was a bug and released a fix for it, which I have installed: what kind of fix would it be if it didn't solve the problem at all?
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  8. Join Date : Dec 2013
    Portsmouth Hampshire
    Posts : 1,163
    Windows 10 x86 14383 Insider Pro and Core 10240
       4 Weeks Ago #8

    Sorry you feel ignored Mariam, more than likely, folk here just have no answers for you.

    I still use Office 97, because it still works, it's lightweight, very fast and portable, and networked, and my ancient license still is valid. There is nothing more I need except for the Office 2007 converter pack to read docx, xlsx, and so on. No automatic updates, except for the 2007 convertor. My documents are indistinguishable from those printed or converted to PDF from any more recent MS Office version.

    So I have not experienced your problem - and to be frank, I don't understand your measurements - 8.43 or 8.38 ... what units? - or your math: 8.43 = 64 pixels and 8.38 = 72 pixels??? (8.43>8.38, but 64<72 - just does not compute), nor your apparently arbitrary use of a comma or a period as the decimal separator several times in your original post.

    So a certain number of members here may have dismissed your original post as jokey, or even trolling, since there are some apparently nonsensical statements, and other oddities mentioned above.

    If the newer Windows fonts (as introduced almost a decade ago in Vista or Office 2007) such as Calibri (which replaced the older Arial in Office versions since first introduced) are affecting screen sizes of Excel cells, I find it is doubtful that that is the case.

    According to Microsoft support for Office at:

    Change the column width and row height - Excel

    - "The default row height is 12.75 points (approximately 1/6 inch or 0.4 cm)."

    The article also has instructions for changing column width in Office versions 2016-2013 and 2010-2007.

    Maybe that will help you to standardize your spreadsheet cell sizes.

    Now I see where the 8.43* comes from - it is the number of characters of the default Calibri font in a default cell. How on earth do you measure that, or the 8.38 that is bothering you? I just automatically adjust the column width to fit the widest entry by selecting the column and double clicking the column width cursor.

    *This is also standard width in Excel 97, where the font default is Arial 10pt, on Windows 10 AU. You learn something new every day on TF!
    Last edited by Fafhrd; 4 Weeks Ago at 06:52.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  9. Join Date : Oct 2016
    Posts : 6
    Windows 10
       4 Weeks Ago #9

    Fafhrd said: View Post
    Sorry you feel ignored Mariam, more than likely, folk here just have no answers for you.

    I still use Office 97, because it still works, it's lightweight, very fast and portable, and networked, and my ancient license still is valid. There is nothing more I need except for the Office 2007 converter pack to read docx, xlsx, and so on. No automatic updates, except for the 2007 convertor. My documents are indistinguishable from those printed or converted to PDF from any more recent MS Office version.

    So I have not experienced your problem - and to be frank, I don't understand your measurements - 8.43 or 8.38 ... what units? - or your math: 8.43 = 64 pixels and 8.38 = 72 pixels??? (8.43>8.38, but 64<72 - just does not compute), nor your apparently arbitrary use of a comma or a period as the decimal separator several times in your original post.

    So a certain number of members here may have dismissed your original post as jokey, or even trolling, since there are some apparently nonsensical statements, and other oddities mentioned above.

    If the newer Windows fonts (as introduced almost a decade ago in Vista or Office 2007) such as Calibri (which replaced the older Arial in Office versions since first introduced) are affecting screen sizes of Excel cells, I find it is doubtful that that is the case.

    According to Microsoft support for Office at:

    Change the column width and row height - Excel

    - "The default row height is 12.75 points (approximately 1/6 inch or 0.4 cm)."

    The article also has instructions for changing column width in Office versions 2016-2013 and 2010-2007.

    Maybe that will help you to standardize your spreadsheet cell sizes.

    Now I see where the 8.43* comes from - it is the number of characters of the default Calibri font in a default cell. How on earth do you measure that, or the 8.38 that is bothering you? I just automatically adjust the column width to fit the widest entry by selecting the column and double clicking the column width cursor.

    *This is also standard width in Excel 97, where the font default is Arial 10pt, on Windows 10 AU. You learn something new every day on TF!
    I'm Italian, so I use a comma instead of the period (that's why I've been alternating between the two without maybe even noticing). Here's what I'm talking about Excel stretches workbooks horizontally after Anniversary Update - Microsoft Community(when the width goes from 8.43 to 8.38, the columns get wider because 8.43 equals 64 pixels and 8.38 equals 72 pixels): check out the last part of the first post on this thread, where Raymond Travis points it out. And I've never experienced a height of 12.75: across all the different width values, the height has always stayed 15. Also, hayve I mentioned setting the cell size myself won't do any good because it will still mess up my grids inside my saved files?
    Anyway, if you don't believe me, I suggest you look up "ClearType Excel columns" and you'll get dozens of threads of people complaining about this issue. If the default cell width in Excel 2007 (which I have installed on my home PC) and apparently many other past Excel versions (as you said) is 8.43 and it's gone back to 8.43 also on my laptop now after the most recent Windows 10 update installment, I guess that one is the right width and 8.38 was just the result of a temporary bug. However, I'll copy and paste to you a bunch of threads that are about the same annoying issue:
    -
    http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/msoffice/forum/msoffice_excel-mso_other/why-is-excel-column-pixel-width-different-on/579f462b-34eb-46c3-99a4-b1d93bfce31b
    - Problem Screen Wrap Excel - Microsoft Community
    - Excel stretches workbooks horizontally after Anniversary Update - Microsoft Community
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  10. Join Date : Dec 2013
    Portsmouth Hampshire
    Posts : 1,163
    Windows 10 x86 14383 Insider Pro and Core 10240
       4 Weeks Ago #10

    Now having given some links to other discussion of these issues, I understand where you are coming from. I have no experience of this. Can we do an experiment?

    Here is a screenshot:

    Click image for larger version. 

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Size:	169.7 KB 
ID:	108475

    It shows Windows Anniversary Update, with a spreadsheet in Excel 97, where the worksheet is displayed in the pre-modern Windows style (note the windows control buttons in the title bar of the spreadsheet).

    Note that the different fonts and sizes affect the autosize of the cells. Note also that Calibri behaves differently at 10 pt and 20 pt compared to the other fonts - in places the same text is as long or shorter than Tahoma in column A at the same point size. Calibri also has the blurry font display at 10 pt in cell C3, where the vertical letters "i" and "l" do not respond correctly to ClearType tuning.

    Now this has been saved in the native format for Excel 97 as oldfonts.xls, zipped to oldfonts.zip, and attached below. It should convert to xlsx format on extraction and opening in Excel 2013.

    oldfonts.zip

    Try it and post back your screenshot, if you can.

    Have you attempted to try the remedy given in the Microsoft answers link?
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