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  1. Joined : Jan 2016
    Posts : 3
    WIndows 10 and others
       24 Jan 2016 #121

    Solved: This is a solution that I found that works reliably for me.


    Problem:
    After I allowed my Lenovo laptop to upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 10, ver 1511, the laptop could no longer see most other computers, or any NAS devices on my home network. It could see one Windows 7 computer (sometimes) and my brother’s laptop (sometimes) but that was all. It could not see my three NAS devices, nor my XP computers, nor my Ethernet/USB print server.

    Solution
    Summary: I renamed my Workgroup from its original 5-character name, “WALSH”, to a workgroup name with 7 characters “WALSH01”, or “WALSHES” and suddenly the Windows 10 machine could see my other devices under Network in File Explorer.

    Detailed description:
    After I upgraded my Lenovo laptop from Windows 7 to Windows 10 ver 1511, the laptop could no longer see most other computers, or any NAS devices on my home network. It could see one Windows 7 computer (sometimes, but not reliably), and my brother’s laptop (also sometimes, but not reliably), but that was all. It could not see any of my three NAS devices, nor my XP computers, nor my Ethernet/USB print server.
    I tried many suggested solution on the internet, but none of them worked.
    I reverted back to Windows 7 and I could see my network again. That told me that my network was basically sound.
    In order to start from a known clean state, I did a clean re-installation of Windows 7 Pro from Recovery DVDs, and let Windows 7 apply all the relevant upgrades. At this stage my Lenovo laptop could see all the devices on my network which consisted of 2 x Win XP computers, one Linux computer, one Win 10 computer, one Win 7 computer, three NAS devices, and an Ethernet/USB print server.
    I then let my laptop upgrade to Windows 10.
    After the upgrade, I checked File Explorer > Network (neighbourhood), but the laptop could NOT see any other devices except the other Win 10 computer (sometimes, but not reliably), and the Win 7 computer (also sometimes it would show up but not reliably). No other devices were visible.
    I searched internet forums for days and tried many suggested solutions, none of which worked, and some were just not applicable.
    After many frustrating hours I tried renaming my workgroup to something different.
    My workgroup had been named WALSH, so I renamed it to WALSH01 for the laptop and WALSH01 for one of the NAS devices. I rebooted both, and Windows 10 was suddenly able to see the NAS device under Network in File Explorer. As a trial I renamed the workgroup back to WALSH for the laptop and the NAS device, and File Explorer could no longer see it.
    I repeated this procedure twice more with consistent results each time; that is, when the Win 10 laptop’s workgroup, and the NAS device’s workgroup name was WALSH the laptop COULD NOT see the NAS device, but when I name them to WALSH01, the laptop could see the NAS device.
    I did another test by renaming the workgroup to WALSHES for both the laptop and the NAS device, and the laptop could see the NAS device under Network neighbourhood when the workgroup was named as WALSHES.
    Conclusion:
    The final result of all this is that the Windows 10 laptop CANNOT see a NAS device if the workgroup is called WALSH, but the laptop can see the NAS device if the workgroup name is set to WALSH01, or WALSHES on both devices.
    If I swap from the workgroup name WALSH01 back to WALSH, the devices do NOT appear under Network (neighbourhood).
    I suppose I could generalise and assume that workgroup names of 5 characters DO NOT work reliably for WINDOWS 10, but workgroup names of 7 characters (or more) DO work reliably. I’ll leave that for others to experiment with
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  2. Joined : Oct 2014
    Posts : 1,278
    win 10 Insider
       24 Jan 2016 #122

    The problem is not about workgroup names. Most of us would have WORKGROUP as our workgroup name and that is longer than five characters.

    If you want a deeper understanding of the issue you could do worse than read the thread here:-
    Cannot connect to CIFS / SMB / Samba Network Shares Shared Folders in Windows 10 after update 1511/10586
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  3.    24 Jan 2016 #123

    The problem is that of Win 10 Pro 10586 any version assuming the Master Browser role on a network when another machine already has that role. Get that situation sorted out and things work as expected. This is a Win 10 Pro specific problem as Win 10 Home installs seem not to have this issue.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  4. Joined : Jan 2016
    Posts : 3
    WIndows 10 and others
       24 Jan 2016 #124

    linw said: View Post
    The problem is not about workgroup names. Most of us would have WORKGROUP as our workgroup name and that is longer than five characters.

    If you want a deeper understanding of the issue you could do worse than read the thread here:-
    Cannot connect to CIFS / SMB / Samba Network Shares Shared Folders in Windows 10 after update 1511/10586
    Dear linw,
    Thank you for your reply. I am sure that you are right, in that there is a deeper problem than just the length of the workgroup name. And that problem is probably related to CIFS / SMB (aka Samba) as you say.

    However, the facts are that when I set my workgroup name to a name that is only five characters long, Win10 CANNOT see most of the other devices on my network. But when I rename the workgroup to a seven character name on all my devices and reboot them (which I have just spent the last hour doing), they all show up in File Explorer > Network, and I can access them, and their files easily.
    And if I rename the workgroup back to the five character name WALSH, they all disappear again.

    So perhaps the problem that I am describing, and providing a solution to, is another, and quite different problem to the one you are experiencing, but both problems manifest themselves in the same final symptom that the user experiences, which is that devices on the network do not show up in File Explorer > Network.

    Perhaps these two problems are related somehow, but I don't know enough about CIFS / SMB to be able to comment competently.
    And perhaps my observation might help someone in finding the real problem and the true solution.

    Regards

    Mike W
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  5. Joined : Oct 2014
    Posts : 1,278
    win 10 Insider
       24 Jan 2016 #125

    All 1511 systems have the same network discovery code so all have the problem of reliably displaying windows AND Linux shares.

    A quick test to see if you have the network discovery problem is to run from the command prompt, 'net view'. If the comp is not the master browser, you will likely get a 1231 error.

    @Railtech. I can assure you that the problem most of us are having in this area is not caused by multiple master browsers.

    The thread pointed to above shows this clearly.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  6. Joined : Jan 2016
    Posts : 3
    WIndows 10 and others
       24 Jan 2016 #126

    linw said: View Post
    All 1511 systems have the same network discovery code so all have the problem of reliably displaying windows AND Linux shares.

    A quick test to see if you have the network discovery problem is to run from the command prompt, 'net view'. If the comp is not the master browser, you will likely get a 1231 error.

    @Railtech. I can assure you that the problem most of us are having in this area is not caused by multiple master browsers.

    The thread pointed to above shows this clearly.
    linw,
    I ran net view and it completed successfully as per below

    Server Name Remark
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    \\BA001 BlackArmor No 1.
    \\BA002 BlackArmor NAS BA002
    \\FINCH-A70 finch-A70 server (Samba, Linux Mint)
    \\LENOVO001 LenovoEMC px2-300d
    \\MAGPIE
    \\MAGPIE05 Magpie05
    \\MAGPIE20
    \\MALLARD Lenovo 520
    The command completed successfully.


    \\Mallard is the Win 10 Pro machine.
    \\MAGPIE and \\MAGPIE20 are WinXP machines.
    Regards

    MW
      My System SpecsSystem Spec

  7.    24 Jan 2016 #127

    Isn't there any solution for the average user?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  8. Joined : Oct 2014
    Posts : 1,278
    win 10 Insider
       24 Jan 2016 #128

    @jrmwalsh. Please check whether that comp was the master browser (nbtstat -n will show this). When the comp is the master browser, networking works fine for that machine. The problems occur when a comp has to communicate with the master browser.

    Another complicating factor is the unreliability of results seen. You think all is OK one minute but later it turns back to custard.

    You can get explorer to show the win shares but not Samba/Linux shares. If you force SMB2&3 off, you can see the Linux but not the windows ones. And so it goes on.

    But hope is on the horizon as 11099 and 11102 are using NetBIOS and all seems to work fine again. It just needs to get fixed in the release version.

    Cheers - YMMV!!
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  9. Joined : Oct 2014
    Posts : 1,278
    win 10 Insider
       24 Jan 2016 #129

    lolcocks said: View Post
    Isn't there any solution for the average user?
    There will be a solution when MS fixes the basic problem. An MS guy called Adam says that will happen in March for the standard release!

    What problems are you seeing?
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


  10. Joined : Jan 2016
    Posts : 1
    Windows 10
       25 Jan 2016 #130

    OK so I have read so many forums describing this problem, and have yet to find a solution that fixes my problem. At my company, we have 29 computers hooked up to the network. Most of these computers are running Windows 7, one is running Windows XP, and one is running Windows 10 Home which is a brand new computer. Some of the Windows 7 computers are Windows 7 Professional, I do not know if all of them are Pro or Home. I can see the Windows 10 machine from other computers on the network, but the Windows 10 machine can only see 5 of the computers. I read above that everyone is having trouble with Windows 10 Pro, but I have the Home edition, besides waiting until March when MS can release an update to fix this problem, is there anything I can try to fix this problem.
    Edit: I am not an admin on the network and cannot perform any major changes to the network, if you have a potential solution, make a note if i need admin rights, so that I can talk to IT. Thank you very much.

    I have not tried what Papa _paul 2 stated here, but it would be kind of hard to do this with 29 Computers. If i somehow got all the computers off at the same time, would this for sure work with a work group of this size?
    "The issue for me is solved. Here are the steps I took, but I'm not sure they were necessary. I would try step 3 first and if that doesn't work, try 1 & 2 and then 3 again.

    1) Deleted the idstore.sset file found in the \Windows\ServiceProfiles\LocalService\AppData\Roaming\PeerNetworking folder of your system drive (for example, drive C). It was really idstore.sst.

    2) Went to services.msc and enabled (automatic):

    "peer network grouping"

    "peer network identity manager"

    "homegroup listener"

    "homegroup provider"

    3) Steps 1 & 2 didn't seem to be working so I shut down all 4 PCs and went to bed. In the morning I only turned on my newest formerly WIN 8 laptop. I knew that this PC never hosted the "Ghost" HOMEGROUP. I opened HOMEGROUP and it allowed me to set up a new one and gave me a new password. I turned on the other 3 PCs and HOMEGROUP connected with the new PW. So I think the issue may be is that if the PC that created the "ghost" HOMEGROUP is powered up WIN 10 sees the "GHOST" as active and tries to connect to it."
    Link to Papa_paul 2 solution: WIN 10 Homegroup issues - Forums - CNET
    Last edited by tricktrack1971; 25 Jan 2016 at 12:15.
      My System SpecsSystem Spec


 
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