GPT vs MBR

Slartybart · 25 Sep 2015

topgundcp said:

Slartybart,

This partition was created during the upgrade from 8 => 10 and Winre.wim which contains a set of recovery tools, initially was in partition 1 and now resides in partition 5 with a new set of tools for Windows 10 after the upgrade.

Thanks topgundcp, but this machine is new from an OEM (HP).

Yep, I've seen Windows punt during an upgrade ... "resizing" the "Recovery" part by creating a new part (every freaking time an upgrade is performed!) I've seen some machines with 4 or more 450 MB Recovery parts all stuck on the end. It makes it quick and dirty for MS, but a pain for the user

The 1+ GB Recovery as the 1st part threw me off, but I'm not surprised that HP does it "their way". I suspect that "their way" is to put their bloat in that recovery and tell you to create your own recovery drive (or buy one from them). Not really certain about that though.

I'm not sure If I posted it in this thread, but these Technet pages are what I reference (even though they're Win8)
I adjust the WinRE part to 450 MB for UEFI | GPT (or combined System Reserved + WinRE to 500 MB for BIOS | MBR).

NavyLCDR and I worked on one thread that was a strange Hybrid (BIOS with UEFI | GPT partitioning) - the solution was to grow the EFI System part to 363 MB (member's choice on size, I suggested 450 MB). What these OEMs do and why is beyond my comprehension !

Configure UEFI/GPT-Based Hard Drive Partitions
Sample: Configure UEFI/GPT-Based Hard Drive Partitions by Using Windows PE and DiskPart

I recently set up a fresh Win10 Hyper-V machine (to get UEFI) and the default partition sizes do not match the Technet documentation, so I fed MS and asked for those pages to accurately reflect Win10. It's actually pretty cool how Win10 sets up the pars and vols (they don't match 1-to-1 (par1=vol2 - I had a text doc, but can't locate it now).

Anyway ... I've been wrestling with the latest round of AMD drop on my insider build for the past two days .. so this post is well past the expiration date

OldMike,

I apologize for the diskpart command omission, I forgot to put the partition parameter on the detail cmd.
I corrected that post, but there's no sense in you revisiting the commands at this point.

OldMike65 · 25 Sep 2015

Ok guys, after reinstalling today 3 times, I finally got it right, to the point where I like the way my partitions are setup.
Before, it was pretty messed up. This is a new computer for me, but it is used, its a year old. Previous owner thought he had it setup for any new owner, but I found lots of his stuff still on this computer, plus the partitions were screwed.
I thought I could get rid of his personal stuff, without doing a clean install, Wrong....lol Anyhow, now I will be spending days reinstalling all my registered apps. Later....

topgundcp · 25 Sep 2015

Yep. This is the way the partitions layout should be. Compare yours and mine, they are almost identical. The next step is to run Windows Updates then from the Admin command prompt, copy and paste:

Dism.exe /online /Cleanup-Image /StartComponentCleanup&dism /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth&sfc /scannow&pause

To clean up all the remnants from Windows installation, you should be able to reclaim some more free space then use your backup program to create an image before installing the rest of your apps.

OldMike65 · 25 Sep 2015

topgundcp said:

Yep. This is the way the partitions layout should be. Compare yours and mine, they are almost identical. The next step is to run Windows Updates then from the Admin command prompt, copy and paste:

Dism.exe /online /Cleanup-Image /StartComponentCleanup&dism /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth&sfc /scannow&pause

To clean up all the remnants from Windows installation, you should be able to reclaim some more free spacethen use your backup programs to create an image before installing the rest of your apps.

Yes sir, and thanks for this tip!!!!!! I will admit I'm already getting tired, been on this sucker, for many hours. :) But now won't have to worry about this OS, just got to spend a few days installing my apps, and in some cases, having to explain to some of the company's why I need to re-register. I will copy and paste that command now. Thanks everyone.........hug for the Word Man tooo hehehe. :)

Word Man · 25 Sep 2015

OldMike65 said:

..Thanks everyone.........hug for the Word Man tooo hehehe. :)

LOL - it was all fun. Oddly enough, I see a lot written about that MSR being usually 128 MB. Both MY clean install on my laptop (per system spec, with factory HDD swapped out to 850 EVO 500 GB) and my son's brand new identical laptop (but with factory 1TB HDD, after I upgraded and clean installed it) ended with a 16 MB MSR, just like yours. For whatever reason we had in common, I guess Windows decided to gobble up 112 MB for something or thought 16 MB was enough going out the gate.

Here's mine -

AthanasianCreed · 26 Sep 2015

Mike,

Did you know that in version 9.1 of MiniTool Partition Wizard under 'Disk' tab there is an option to convert GPT/MBR disk to MBR/GPT disk without loss of data? Also, i notice you also use Acronis TI 2016 (?) - do you use the very popular feature 'Try & Decide' (which was in version 2014 (which i use), taken out of 2015 version and, after much customer consternation, reinstated in 2016 version. Anywho, the feature does NOT work (according to their customer forum) if you have GPT partitions (i have not used the feature so i couldn't say). Just a FYI.

As for your initial disk setup, mine is even worse. When i upgraded to Win 10.537, the installer added another 1,000 MB unalloted 'partition' - and none of it has been used for anything!

I've been following this thread very closely (and others like it) because i'd like to convert my GPT partition to MBR but have been hesitant to do so to this point because i'm afraid of screwing something up. I'm pretty sure, using diskpart/GParted i'd probably be fine but.....

OldMike65 · 26 Sep 2015

Well Hi AthanasianCreed wow....long name. :) Yes before I changed my partitions, I had one that was close to a gig. But mine was not empty, maybe 360mg used. But didn't matter no partition needs a 1gb recovery partition. But after doing a clean install, which took me 2 times, screwed it up once. The final result came out just what I was looking for. I was also thinking of changing everything to MBR, long and hard I thought about it. Maybe for about a week. But in my case, this computer is only 1 year old, and I just bought it used, for a REAL nice price. The spec's are like 3 times better than the computer it replaced. This new computer is built around using UEFI standard. Does have a feature for legacy support. But it was made for UEFI format. That is what made my mind up to keep GPT style.
Now as far as Acronis goes, nice info you reported, but in my case, I've been using Acronis since 2009. So I have boot disks for every release since then. The main boot disk I have been using is my 2014 version, even thou I installed 2016. The newer version can read any image backup I make using my 2014 boot disk. So I'm really not losing any features. I also don't think I've ever used Try & Decide. All I use Acronis for is making image backups, and restoring those images, if needed. Nothing else. I do use verify after making every backup. Never had a problem with reinstalling any image file I've made, since 2009 using Acronis. Don't care much for the 2016 version, but I always get their latest release. Last release 2016 was free for me, because I had just bought 2015. lol
Only cost me about 29 bucks a release anyhow. Upgrade price. Macrium Reflect I also gave a try, cause everyone was saying how great it is........I didn't like it at all, at least 3 times slower than ANY version of Acronis I've ever owned. Takes like 2 days to boot from DVD. I'll pass on that one, and if you actually want to buy it, 70.00!!! No way it that slow piece of software worth 20 bucks. Just my opinion is all. But for all you folks that love it, that's fine with me, and I respect your view.
later.....

OldMike65 · 27 Sep 2015

Ok I hate to do this, but, seems I may have been wrong about Macrium Refect. I did 2 image backups this morning. 1st one I used my Acronis 2016, took about 3 mins. BUT didn't see all 4 partitions, only saw 3. That made me nervous. So, I grabbed my Macrium boot dvd and ran that. Macrium saw all 4 partitions, took 7 mins to image boot drive. Also THIS time only took about 1 or 2 mins to boot up from DVD. Last time I used Macrium it took a VERY long time, but that was before I did the clean install. What made this difference I don't know? So because Acronis does seem to have a problem seeing GPT partitions, I just might have to use Macrium.
This does piss me off, cause I have been using Acronis since 2009, and it has never failed me.

Word Man · 27 Sep 2015

OldMike65 said:

Ok I hate to do this, but, seems I may have been wrong about Macrium Refect. I did 2 image backups this morning. 1st one I used my Acronis 2016, took about 3 mins. BUT didn't see all 4 partitions, only saw 3. That made me nervous. So, I grabbed my Macrium boot dvd and ran that. Macrium saw all 4 partitions, took 7 mins to image boot drive. Also THIS time only took about 1 or 2 mins to boot up from DVD. Last time I used Macrium it took a VERY long time, but that was before I did the clean install. What made this difference I don't know? So because Acronis does seem to have a problem seeing GPT partitions, I just might have to use Macrium.
This does piss me off, cause I have been using Acronis since 2009, and it has never failed me.

OldMike - think about it this way - the MSR is NOT a partition - it's unallocated space. You only have 3 partitions with something on them. Acronis no doubt is only looking to back up your partitions with data - I assume it would place those in the same position those 3 are on your disk but haven't used it in years. Macrium is showing you a map of your entire disk, including unallocated space, offering to back up the entire DISK and keeping track of exactly where unallocated space is.

That's why in prior conversation I said your clean install would give you 3 partitions and an MSR.

I don't think you necessarily have a problem with Acronis or that it has a problem seeing GPT disks correctly - it's just a matter of understanding how it's representing things to you. I would hope that Acronis is capable of doing a full disk image and then restoring it to exactly what was imaged across the entire disk, either by default or with proper settings.

OldMike65 · 27 Sep 2015

Word Man said:

OldMike -
I don't think you necessarily have a problem with Acronis or that it has a problem seeing GPT disks correctly - it's just a matter of understanding how it's representing things to you. I would hope that Acronis is capable of doing a full disk image and then restoring it to exactly what was imaged across the entire disk, either by default or with proper settings.

Well you might be right Word Man, but from my past experience using Acronis, if it don't see a partition, then doing a restore it will only restore what it reports it saw during the backup. Of course the only way to actually find out, is to restore that image I made. Which at this point, I have no interest in testing that theory right now.